44th Parl. 1st Sess.
June 20, 2022 11:00AM
Mr. Speaker, there are two comments that stood out in that speech.
At one point, the member referenced that the bill would not control what people would say, but would only open the door for more Canadian content. In other words, that is the government, through this bill, controlling what people would see on the Internet, even if it is more Canadian content. The member might agree that seeing more Canadian content online is good, but again that is the algorithms taking away choice and determining what Canadians will actually see and be pointed to in their viewing activities on the Internet.
Second, I believe that during the committee hearings, Mr. Scott, the head of the CRTC, stated in reference to section 4.2 that this bill “allows the CRTC to prescribe by regulation user-uploaded content subject to very explicit criteria.” How does the member square what the CRTC is already saying about this bill with his words today here in the House?
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Mr. Speaker, the member suggested I am seeing things that are not there. I think he is actually right. There are some things I am seeing that are not there.
What I am seeing that is not there is the idea of freedom from the government, the idea of respecting people's rights, the idea that we can actually let Canadians choose for themselves what they want to see on the Internet, what they want to see on their social media and what they do not, and the idea that we can actually enable Canadian content producers to produce the great content they produce without the need for the government to prop them up with censorship.
Those are the things I am seeing that are not there. Those are the things the government is doing, and those things should not be there.
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Mr. Speaker, this again feels like a bad movie where the Conservative Party members are opposing just for the sake of opposing.
I will ask my colleague a two-part question. I hope his answer will show me that they are not opposing for the sake of opposing, in this case.
He spoke about local Canadian content and how to determine whether content is local. He seemed to be criticizing the implementation of a point system. He gave the example of a movie that talked about Toronto but was filmed in the United States. From what I understood, he seemed to be saying that it would be acceptable to consider that movie Canadian content. I am sorry, but if the royalties and all the actors were paid in the U.S. and all that money is going to stay in the U.S., then I do not think that qualifies as local content, just like an Australian movie that talks about Quebec would not be considered local content either.
I have two questions. First, if we do not have a point system, a mathematical formula or some fairly logical way of assessing whether content is local, how are we going to determine that? What does my colleague propose?
Second, is he really opposed to showcasing Canadian content and giving jobs to people here, whether in Quebec or Canada?
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Mr. Speaker, I think that question gets at the heart of one of the challenges with the bill. I mentioned during my speech the fact that there essentially is a lot of room for interpretation, and a lot of grey area, in terms of how this would all be implemented. I think leaving Canadians in the dark in such a way, when we are talking about essentially censoring what kind of content they can see without even knowing how it would be censored and in what ways, makes for greater concerns than the fact that things are going to be censored to begin with. I think that really gets to the heart of one of the big problems with the bill, and I appreciate the member raising that and giving me a chance to highlight that one more time.
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Madam Speaker, I would like my colleague to further clarify the very important concept of discoverability. How can we establish processes to force platforms to make local content more visible? How does this not threaten freedom of expression, despite the criticisms we have heard, which I think are highly exaggerated?
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Madam Speaker, earlier in our debate today, the government of Canada outlined that its intent was not to regulate the programs and content that Canadians were viewing online, but simply to open the door to more Canadian content. In other words, it was skirting the question. Mr. Scott, the chair of the CRTC, said during the proceedings that this bill, Bill C-11, would allow the CRTC to prescribe regulation to user-uploaded content.
Does the NDP support more oversight over what Canadians want to view, especially as it relates to the arts and culture sector?
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Madam Speaker, the legislation enables the CRTC and the government to ensure that those who are streaming are contributing to the development of the industry here in Canada. It is not necessarily to say that those programs would never have stood a chance, but let us recognize that having things such as the CRTC greatly enhances the opportunity for artists all over our country to have future prospects and encourages more Canadian content to support minorities. Whether it is in our multicultural communities or indigenous communities, it provides for Canadians to tell our stories more than we could without the legislation. That is something that I suspect the member who posed the question could not deny.
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Madam Speaker, I want to make clear to the parliamentary secretary that I do agree with him.
As I said in my speech, it has been quite some time since the Broadcasting Act was first passed. There is an important need to modernize the Act, and I am glad the governing party prioritized that. I also believe it is important to get it right. While there are many stakeholders, as he has mentioned, who are supportive, there are also many others, some of whom I mentioned, such as Canadian YouTube content creators, who are quite concerned.
I go back again. Yes, it is a difficult decision not to support this legislation, but the analysis I am doing is weighing harm versus good. My concern here is that, with this legislation as currently written, given some of the vague language and allowing for user-generated content to be regulated as it does, it is open to the possibility of more harm than good.
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Madam Speaker, I am pleased to learn that my colleague plans to support the bill. I admit that I was concerned about the Green Party members, especially when I heard the member for Kitchener Centre take the Conservative position on the issue of digital content creators, on the exemption and on clause 4.2 in particular.
I wondered whether my colleague shared that position and whether she also believed that this clause gave her cause for concern respecting freedom of expression and freedom of creation by these new artists, who are carving out more and more space in our landscape and from whom we will benefit a lot in the years to come, I am sure.
My other question has to do with the Canadian content she was talking about. She brought up The Handmaid's Tale, saying that Bill C‑11 would correct the fact that a production like that was not considered Canadian content.
I want to understand something. Does my colleague think that this content will become Canadian content or, on the contrary, does she think that the rules have to be tightened so that anything produced with stories from here are also produced by artists and talent from here?
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Madam Speaker, I was intently listening to the member opposite on his speech, and he mentioned the approach we are taking. We are listening to stakeholders and content creators, and I would like to share a quote with him from the Society of Composers, Authors and Music Publishers of Canada. I would say they know better than most of us here about content creation. Their CEO said this:
Canadian creators need support to continue to develop Canadian music in the world of streaming, and Canada must be a place for emerging music creators, where songwriters and composers can create, grow and thrive.
Their news release went on:
The tabling of the Online Streaming Act on February 2, 2022, is an important first step to make it easier for Canadian audiences to find and engage with Canadian creators, giving our music a place in the world of streaming.
I would like to ask the member opposite what he thinks about this quote from content creators themselves.
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Madam Speaker, I welcome my colleague's support for this bill. It explicitly excludes all user-created content on social media platforms and streaming services. These exclusions mean that experiences for users creating, posting and interacting with other user-generated content will not be impacted whatsoever.
I would like to ask my hon. colleague what he thinks of the Conservatives, who have been misleading Canadians regarding this bill.
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Madam Speaker, in thinking back to Progressive Conservative governments of the past, they very much championed the idea that television corporations or radio corporations, for example, would have an obligation to support Canadian content. The world has changed very much since the last time the Broadcasting Act was updated in 1991. Streaming services play a fundamental role and are even more important than radio and television in terms of story creation.
Why not ask those streaming services to support the creation of Canadian content? That is my question to the member. That is the fundamental aim of this bill.
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Madam Speaker, I want to thank my colleague from South Shore—St. Margarets for his speech. I had the pleasure of sitting with him during the clause-by-clause consideration of Bill C-11, and we had a lot of fun. It was probably the most entertaining part of the study, I must say.
Having said that, in his speech, he talked about how the legislation would allow the CRTC to regulate content such as user-generated content, which I think is an unfounded statement. I am wondering how many opinions he would have needed to hear to convince him that there is no infringement on freedom of expression or on user-generated content. Clearly, I am talking about opinions that were contrary to the few that were presented by the witnesses invited by the Conservatives. I would like to hear what my colleague has to say about this. I know he did not attend all the committee meetings, but I think he has a pretty good idea of our work.
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Mr. Speaker, what this bill does is it makes sure that we become a juggernaut when it comes to supporting Canadian music, artists and talent. I can tell members that my constituents and many great artists need and want the opportunities to flourish and to be able to become those great artists, many of the great artists that I mentioned a few minutes ago in my speech.
This bill also makes sure that we can support those Canadian artists and content, as well as support Black, indigenous and racialized communities across Canada.
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Mr. Speaker, over the years, I have had many conversations with content originators, mainly musicians, who have complained that in the current online environment it is almost impossible to make a living, and it is suffocating the Canadian music industry. I wonder if the member could tell us more about how this bill will help them to survive and thrive.
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Mr. Speaker, absolutely, yes, I would.
This bill explicitly excludes all user-created content on social media platforms and streaming services. These exclusions mean that the experience for users creating, hosting and interacting with other user-generated content will not be impacted whatsoever, while the treatment of commercial content such as TV shows and all songs across all platforms will still be standardized.
This bill tells the CRTC to work with platforms to ensure a certain amount of Canadian content is showcased on platforms in both official languages as well as indigenous languages. Clause 12 of the online streaming act explicitly states that any regulation that CRTC imposes on platforms through the Broadcasting Act cannot infringe on Canadians' freedom of expression on social media.
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Mr. Speaker, it is indeed an honour to stand in the House once again to represent my constituents of Richmond Hill. As I join you from the national capital region, I respectfully acknowledge that the land on which I am located today is the traditional ancestral unceded territory of the Algonquin Anishinabe people.
The government is committed to implementing its digital and cultural policy agenda, which would serve Canadian interests not only today, but also well into the future. It would support our cultural and artistic ecosystem, including our many talented creative sector workers. This is urgently needed.
Today, I am pleased to speak to important elements of the online streaming act. First, I will have the pleasure of talking about the Canadian independent producers and the important role that they play. Second, I want to talk about the importance of ensuring that Canadians can find and access Canadian stories and music.
Delaying Bill C-11 would do harm to our production industry. It would leave the creative ecosystem in a very uncertain and difficult place without support and predictable funding for Canadian programs. Ultimately, the online streaming act aims to foster an environment where Canadian music and stories can thrive and be discovered. The time to act is now, and there is a lot at stake.
Turning an idea into a cultural product is no simple task. From coast to coast to coast, our creatives have undeniable talent and unparalleled work ethics. Canada's independent producers are an example of this.
A Canadian independent producer is a Canadian person or entity, usually a corporation, that creates an audiovisual media project that is not owned or controlled by a broadcaster or a distributor. In other words, independent producers make movies, TV shows and documentaries that are not subject to creative controls by a TV channel, network, streaming service or cable company. They are crucial to creative risk-taking, authentic storytelling and diverse representation in our audiovisual sector.
In film and television, independent productions cover a wide range of formats and genres, from art house films to popular animated kids shows and everything in between. To successfully realize a project, independent producers do many things. They invest in development, make pitches, secure financing, hire creative and technical teams, scout locations, and navigate complex trade, tax and labour arrangements to make projects happen. Not surprisingly, Canadian independent producers often work closely with Canadian musicians for scores and soundtracks.
There are over 600 independent production companies in Canada, most of them small and surviving project to project. In 2019-20, Canadian independent film and television accounted for $2.9 billion in production volume and more than 81,000 jobs. Many of these independent production companies are undercapitalized and often face difficulty obtaining project financing. In Canada, once a finished project is in hand, all the rights for its creative elements are clear. The producers can then make money, but it is risky business with a lot of upfront costs.
While we may recognize some Canadian landmarks in the background of some American productions, these companies work with Canadian talent below the line: the “best boys”, “grips” and “gaffers” listed in movie credits. They work with our visual effects, post-production and virtual production studios, who are valuable without a doubt.
However, Canadian productions, and specifically independent Canadian productions, are important for ensuring that the cultural industry investments touch down and take root in the places where our stories come from. For example, just one season of Heartland spent over $28 million on production, saw each dollar of federal tax incentive produce more than $11 in GDP, and hired more than 1,400 vendors across Alberta.
Independent Canadian productions also tell untold stories and develop diverse programming. Diversity is one of Canadians' greatest strength. Without independent producers taking risks, we would never have films such as Water in Hindi or Edge of the Knife in the endangered Haida language.
Our stories and our creative talent are at the heart of the online streaming act. The legislation lists several important factors for the CRTC to consider in its definition of Canadian programs, such as, for example, collaboration between Canadian producers, Canadian ownership and exploitation of IP by Canadians. This would give the commission the flexibility to require all types of broadcasting undertakings, including online streaming services, to financially contribute to the development of Canadian programs and talent. That is what Canada's important independent production sector needs to continue to thrive.
A strong independent production sector ensures Canadian stories are told by and for Canadians. However, it is not enough to encourage the production side alone. It is important that Canadians can find and access Canadian stories and music as well. As we see more of ourselves reflected in these popular mediums, it creates a sense of pride and a sense of unity, precisely when we need them during these difficult times.
The influx of streaming programs has meant access to endless content, but it can be difficult to find or even recognize Canadian programs. This is in part because online platforms are not required to showcase Canadian programs in the same way as the traditional broadcasters. Our independent productions, and especially Canadian music, deserve to be discovered and supported. However, in the current context, it is challenging for independent producers to remain visible in the marketplace.
Word-of-mouth marketing is no longer sufficient. Our musical tastes are increasingly dictated by algorithms. What we are asking for has proven successful in the past. Forty-one years ago, the federal government stepped in with requirements for CanCon to save our singers and musicians from being lost to the radio hits from the United States.
Without prominence, Canadian stories and songs will not be discovered, heard or remunerated. The intent behind showcasing Canadian stories and music is not to limit consumer choice, but to help raise the profile of Canadian artists. Regulation would not prevent Canadians from accessing programs from around the world. It would give us greater opportunity to discover local ones. The CRTC would work directly with platforms to determine how they can best showcase more Canadian content.
Discoverability is a tool to help audiences find Canadian works. It would ultimately be up to the commission, as the expert, independent regulator, to craft discoverability requirements that are appropriate for different types of online streaming services. The commission's scope is limited in the bill and would be further guided by the government's policy direction, as is common practice.
In closing, whether we are individual fans and consumers, career showrunners and artists, or industry players, the truth is that we are all invested in the vibrancy of Canadian stories and music. We need Canadian stories and songs to be available and accessible to Canadians. With the online streaming act, we will not just hope but plan for meaningful and sustainable change for our broadcasting and audiovisual sectors, and the production and distribution ecosystem that supports them.
This bill would provide Canadian creators and independent producers the opportunity to own, control and monetize their work, and gives Canadian stories and music a fighting chance to reach the Canadian audience that wants to hear or see them. I urge all members of the House to support the online streaming act. It is time for us to work together to ensue that our cultural sector remains strong, resilient, competitive and representative of our beautiful country.
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Mr. Speaker, I am glad the member was in the House when I was delivering the speech. I have been intervening in the House for a number of years.
It is not so much about how many people will be employed by the CRTC. It is the fact that the CRTC will be empowered and in a position to administer the bill, while collaboratively working with producers to ensure that Canadian content is not only developed but highlighted and properly compensated. It will not necessarily be all the content from social media and various platforms that will be subjected to that rule.
When we look at it, although the amount of content that is being tabled is a lot, the content producers are the ones who the CRTC will work with. They make up a much smaller number than the content creators. That will determine, as time goes on, how many people will be needed.
That was a hypothetical question, but I think it is a question that is worth taking note of.
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