44th Parl. 1st Sess.
November 21, 2022
- 04:57:56 p.m.
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Good afternoon, everyone.
Members of the Standing Committee on Foreign Affairs and International Development, I'd like to thank you for giving me the opportunity to appear before you today.
My name is Alice Chipot, and I'm the executive director of the Regroupement pour la responsabilité sociale des entreprises, the RRSE.
Our organization is located in Montreal and is comprised of more than 50 committed investors, including religious communities, foundations, non-profit organizations, research centres and individuals. For more than 20 years, we've been working for business practices and corporate behaviours that are in line with the expectations of Quebec and Canadian society. We work for greater social and environmental justice.
RRSE has joined with the Canadian Network on Corporate Accountability, or CNCA, to push for a comprehensive due diligence framework in Canada.
There are several points I'd like to highlight.
First, we applaud Parliament's efforts to eradicate modern slavery and all forms of forced labour in internationalized supply chains. That said, we believe that the bill currently under consideration misses its purpose and target by seeking to segment the human rights issue without providing effective legislative mechanisms.
The current wording of Bill S‑211 espouses the philosophy of small steps and, at it stands, is too weak to have the right effect. It's based on the idea of reporting and on marginal, even symbolic, penalties and fines for bad actors among companies.
At RRSE, we're a group of investors. We've been doing shareholder engagement for 20 years. What does that mean? It means that we work with the concept of reporting, with data based on ESG criteria, that is to say environmental, social and good governance criteria, and that we look closely at information on value chains. We work with what companies report, with what they agree to report, and with the information made available by rating agencies and other institutions.
While some companies are showing improvements in human rights, it's easy to say that reporting isn't enough to really have the desired effect and avoid negative consequences for the environment and the human condition.
Only a review of Canada's legislative and regulatory framework to protect against and punish repeat bad actors will provide an appropriate response. It's essential to identify existing risks, but also to provide mechanisms for condemnation and redress in the event of abuse. To do that, judges must be given a role and a place, because that is the only real deterrent.
There are good practices. They're not present or represented in this text. They should be looked at on the European side, particularly in France, Germany and the Netherlands. This would allow us to create a common basis, a reality of territories that complement each other.
We've just come out of COP27, where we heard the claims of the people of the southern part of the globe. So I add my voice to that of Jacques Nzumbu, a Jesuit expert on Canadian mining companies, who came to see you a few weeks ago and who repeatedly explained the reality of his community, that is to say the reality of the children and women who work in mining companies in the Congo.
I would also like to add my voice to those of the Uighurs in Montreal who came to see us at the RRSE to ask us to help them and to make visible the reality of modern slavery in supply chains, wondering what action Canada was taking.
Finally, I would like to add my voice to that of Kalpona Akter, who travelled a long way from Bangladesh to come and talk to us about the reality and condition of the workers she is working with.
In a nutshell, from the RRSE's perspective, reporting is not enough. In this day and age, we need a more ambitious and effective voice that provides a stronger ethical framework for the practices of large companies.
Thank you.
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- 05:10:15 p.m.
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I'll refer the question on the definition proposals to Ms. Dwyer from CNCA because I know they've done a lot of work on this.
We certainly need to broaden our understanding of human rights and social and environmental consequences. We shouldn't be segmenting things as we are doing now with a bill that specifically targets modern slavery. We need to look at things more broadly.
The strength of the German and French bills, for example, is that they are broader in scope, meaning that there are more types of organizations and companies targeted, while at the same time providing for sanctions and the possibility of going to court, before a common law judge, to obtain a conviction.
If you want further clarification, Ms. Dwyer will tell you exactly what the definition should be.
Have I answered your question?
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- 05:13:35 p.m.
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I would like to seize this opportunity, after the comment that was made to your colleague a few minutes ago.
There is currently a movement building around this issue. However, there is a risk of slowing this momentum by implementing ineffective legislative mechanisms. The European Union has adopted directives. Canada could also have more effective and efficient rules.
Ms. Dwyer, would you like to round out my answer?
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- 05:28:33 p.m.
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We could indeed try to add a few elements to this bill that would apply in a gradual way, but it's the very spirit of the bill that's problematic, since the bill is based on the idea of reporting. In fact, whenever bills are based on the idea of reporting, we find that the only externality is that it stimulates a service sector of the economy that is used to collecting information on large companies. In the responsible investment community, we can already see that actors are preparing to be able to report on issues surrounding modern slavery.
The basic problem is the spirit of the bill. If we want to eradicate the problem and have a real impact, the challenge isn't to better identify the phenomenon, but rather to have a coherent due diligence framework inspired by European best practices. I think we're at that point.
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