Senator Gold: Indeed, we can’t, shouldn’t and are not. Minister Joly is in Kenya meeting with humanitarian groups, among others, to see how we can play a role and coordinate with others to alleviate the human suffering that this war and this violence have engendered.

In that regard, Canada remains committed to do what it can with allies and partners in the region in that respect.

Senator Downe: Obviously, the policy has changed. Years ago, when I was on CIBA, the position was quite clear. Senators participated, and, as you stated, there are always reasons some people can’t go. There was never a full allocation. However, I can’t understand how the committee can write the report when some of the committee members participated in all the meetings, and others did not. Notwithstanding they may read the transcript or look at it on Zoom, there are nuances that are missed. How do you intend to square that when you write your final report?

Senator Boehm: Well, thank you Senator Downe. This study has been going on for some time — since April of last year. In my view, all committee members have had a pretty good exposure to various witnesses. I don’t have the data in front of me in terms of how many witnesses we have seen and heard, but I do think that writing the report with all the data and information we have received will not be that onerous and that senators will be prepared.

Also, on the trip that I had mentioned, we are not looking at substitute senators either. So everyone has been exposed to this one way or the other.

Senator Duncan: Thank you very much for that response. Is there perhaps a greater window, then, if we were to focus the energies of the bill and the regulation on the equipment? As I understand it, that is a key presentation that has been made.

Also, the workers’ compensation boards meet at least every year. There is a meeting of all of the boards across the country. Perhaps there could be a recommendation to the minister responsible in the bill that he or she be in attendance and attempt to work with the provinces and territories on this very important issue.

Senator Jaffer: Thank you, senator. What you said is very true — there is a time and place — but the world is small. We may reach out and get Canadians out, but there are also Sudanese who are suffering terribly, especially women and children.

What humanitarian efforts are Canada making with other countries to help out in this region? We can’t forget the suffering of the Sudanese either.

Senator Gold: The government has taken and is taking action. As the news has reported, the Royal Canadian Mounted Police, or RCMP, continues its investigations into the allegations that have been made in the press and will continue to investigate them. Decisions will be taken and will be made public when they are. It is simply not the case that the government is not taking the proper steps to protect us from foreign interference.

I have responded to this question time and time again. They are factual responses, not rhetoric.

Senator Yussuff: Thank you very kindly for your question. I think you address one of the most fundamental challenges that firefighters, and their families, face when they get ill as a result of their work. Because, of course, the provinces, to a large extent, establish workers’ compensation systems, it is for them to adapt their system to recognize these carcinogens have a critical impact on the lives of these workers when they go to work. Of course, we don’t have consistency across the country.

It is mind-boggling today that in some jurisdictions, 29 of the carcinogens are recognized for what they are. In other places, it’s 9 or 16 or fewer than that.

So the reality is, of course, that the firefighters who are lucky enough to live where an enlightened province or territory has taken the decision to add more carcinogens to the list of carcinogens that workers can be impacted by in terms of their work will get workers’ compensation benefits should they get sick, but in many places, they fall between the cracks.

Within the federal jurisdiction, as you know, there is no workers’ compensation system. I would say it would be unwise to put an amendment in the bill and somehow think that will motivate the provinces. It would be critical for the federal government to try to bring the provinces and the territories together, for one, to show what some of the provinces and territories are doing, which is very positive and enlightening, but also to recognize that other provinces should acknowledge that this is the direction they need to go in.

I know in your own territory, you have done the most in regard to recognizing carcinogens, and that is a result of enlightened political leadership. In some provinces, we have a distance to go.

Many firefighters who are dying as a result of these carcinogen-related cancers are hopeful that in the near future all provinces and territories will adopt a common standard of how they treat workers when they get ill and, more importantly, of course, provide them the compensation they need, recognizing that giving compensation does not resolve the issue of dying from a carcinogen, which is a bigger challenge we have to face. How do we prevent those carcinogens from getting into our society? More importantly, how do we ensure the equipment these workers are using when they go into buildings and homes to fight fires is not making them sick when they come home to their families?

Senator Housakos: Will there be any point in investigating?

Senator Dagenais: You talked about telework. As a former union leader, I’d like you to inform the President of the Treasury Board that a letter of understanding on working from home is an integral part of a collective agreement.

This collective agreement represents a $1.3-billion annual wage increase. I’m not opposed to home-based work. However, I’d like to know whether your government knows the real cost of the letter of understanding on working from home. As we’ve come to expect over the past few years, this government continues to sign agreements without considering what it will cost Canadians.

Hon. Senators: Hear, hear!

Senator Kutcher: Thank you for that question. It is an important issue.

My intention is to bring the issue of health disinformation to committee study. I don’t think it would be appropriate for me to tell the committee what the limits of the study should be, or in what direction the committee should choose to study it. Committees are the masters of their own fates, and it would behoove the committee to make those decisions.

We have an incredibly excellent group of people on that committee, as all Senate committees do, and we want to ensure that those committee members and the steering committee — under the able leadership of Senator Omidvar — would make decisions regarding what the parameters of the study would be.

I want to remind the chamber that Senate committees have engaged in studies that have lasted for years, and that have made major impacts on improving Canadian society. My purpose here is to start with health disinformation — and should the committee wish to take it further, that would be the purview of the committee.

Senator Woo: That begs the question as to why the minister said all the Chinese police stations have been stopped. In fact, no evidence has been produced to confirm that there were Chinese police stations in Montreal, and no information has been offered to suggest that the two organizations did anything wrong.

However, the naming of these two groups and Minister Mendicino’s breezy declaration that all police stations have been shut down has cast a pall over the organizations for no reason other than fear, stigma and, dare I say it, racism. Funding for the good work of these organizations has been cut, including French‑language classes and settlement services for new immigrants. The 50-year-old Chinese Family Service of Greater Montreal is now on the brink.

Senator Gold, when will the government clarify that the two organizations have done no wrong, and that, in fact, it is the organizations that have been wronged by reckless allegations, including one we heard today in this chamber? How will the government provide compensation for reputational and financial damage?

Senator Kutcher: If that’s the will of the Senate.

Senator Housakos: They are very serious and they are endless. It seems like information is rolling out case after case about the Prime Minister himself neglecting to come clean and protect Canadians when it comes to foreign interference.

Contrary, again, to Public Safety Minister Marco Mendicino’s claim that all the illegal Beijing police stations in Canada have been shut down, yesterday we found out that’s not the case. We actually now have emboldened agents on behalf of Beijing who are coming out publicly stating they are still operating right here in our country in Montreal.

My question, Senator Gold, is a very simple one: When will those illegal police stations be shut down? When will the diplomat responsible for targeting Michael Chong and his family be expelled from our country? When will your government agree to a public inquiry when it comes to foreign interference? When will your government allow for a registry to be put in place, once and for all, identifying and registering agents who are interfering in our country? When will your government get serious about foreign interference by protecting Canadians who are being intimidated? When are we going to get action other than just rhetoric?

Senator Gold: First of all, the information that was released was, as you said, a confidential Canadian Security Intelligence Service, or CSIS, document. It’s certainly up to CSIS, and only CSIS, to decide what confidential information should be shared. That’s why the Prime Minister asked David Vigneault, the head of CSIS, to look into this matter.

Once again, these issues are complicated, they are serious and the government is dealing with them in a responsible way.

The Hon. the Speaker: Honourable senators, I wish to draw your attention to the presence in the gallery of John Rafferty, President and Chief Executive Officer of the Canadian National Institute for the Blind; our former colleague the Honourable Asha Seth and her spouse, Arun Seth; and Deepak Anand, Member of Provincial Parliament, and his spouse, Aruna Anand. They are the guests of the Honourable Senator Dagenais.

On behalf of all honourable senators, I welcome you to the Senate of Canada.

Senator Gold: Thank you for your question, Senator Woo. As I said, it is my understanding that there are still investigations under way, so I will make inquiries with regard to your questions in an attempt to have an answer as quickly as I can.

[Translation]

Senator Gold: Indeed, we can’t, shouldn’t and are not. Minister Joly is in Kenya meeting with humanitarian groups, among others, to see how we can play a role and coordinate with others to alleviate the human suffering that this war and this violence has engendered.

Senator Gold: Indeed, we can’t, shouldn’t and are not. Minister Joly is in Kenya meeting with humanitarian groups, among others, to see how we can play a role and coordinate with others to alleviate the human suffering that this war and this violence has engendered.

In that regard, Canada remains committed to do what it can with allies and partners in the region in that respect.

Senator Gold: Thank you for your comment.

Colleagues, it’s important to understand and recognize that Canada is committed — and adheres — to a non-discriminatory and fair application of its immigration law. All applications from around the world are assessed against the very same criteria.

In that regard, I assure you again, senator and the chamber, that the government is aware of this issue, is looking into it and will do its best to address this in a timely fashion.

Senator Gold: Thank you for the question. I don’t have the numbers here, and the details aren’t all public, because it’s an agreement in principle, as you know, Senator Dagenais. As soon as the details are clearer and the government has an idea of the cost of telework and that information is made public, I will share it.

My understanding is that the process to address telework issues hasn’t been finalized. There will be a committee to look at the matter, and requests will be dealt with on a case-by-case basis. Having said that, I’ll do my best to get the numbers and provide them to the chamber as soon as possible.

[English]

The Hon. the Speaker: Honourable senators, I wish to draw your attention to the presence in the gallery of John Rafferty, President and Chief Executive Officer of the Canadian National Institute for the Blind; our former colleague the Honourable Asha Seth and her spouse, Arun Seth; and Deepak Anand, Member of Provincial Parliament, and his spouse, Aruna Anand. They are the guests of the Honourable Senator Dagenais.

On behalf of all honourable senators, I welcome you to the Senate of Canada.