Hon. Diane F. Griffin: Senator Gold, will you take a question?

Hon. Marc Gold (Government Representative in the Senate): Thank you. I’m pleased to answer this in my capacity as Government Representative in the Senate. I appreciate, Senator Omidvar, your advance notice of this question.

I’ve made inquiries to the government, but have not heard back. When I do, I will report in a timely fashion.

I would like to add that, to date, the government has approved 9,800 people under the special immigration program, and of this number, more than 3,600 Afghan refugees have already arrived in Canada. Regrettably, the absence of stable conditions and the ever-changing circumstances abroad — regarding what exit documentation is required at checkpoints and international crossings with third countries — make it exceedingly difficult to get Afghan refugees out safely. The government remains committed to welcoming 40,000 Afghan refugees to Canada on the strength of our humanitarian resettlement policy.

Senator Gold: Thank you, senator, for raising this question and for your ongoing commitment to keeping this in the public eye.

As I reported in response to an earlier question, the government has invested tens and tens of millions of dollars in humanitarian aid to various international organizations working on behalf of those struggling and suffering in Afghanistan. It is complicated by the political situation, of course. Canada is doing everything it can. I won’t repeat the figures, but there are significant efforts by Canada in assisting in the humanitarian crisis that is facing too many in Afghanistan.

Senator Gold: The government is committed to doing everything it can both to help in the immediate term but, equally importantly, to take the steps with its partners — provincial and territorial — to build greater resilience into our supply chains and infrastructure. Indeed, Minister Blair underlined that in a recent pronouncement. The government will consider all possible measures, in consultation with its partners.

[Translation]

Hon. Marc Gold (Government Representative in the Senate): Thank you for your question and for your ongoing commitment to the people of Iqaluit. I had the pleasure to visit there some few years ago, as you know.

I have been advised that the government has received a request for funding through the Disaster Mitigation and Adaptation Fund’s large project stream for the City of Iqaluit for the Iqaluit water infrastructure improvement project. The project is currently being assessed. The government is of the view that a long-term solution is infrastructure based, and it is committed to working collaboratively with the city and the territory to arrive at a long-term and viable solution.

Senator Gold: Of course.

Hon. Fabian Manning: Senator Gold, would you take a question, please?

Hon. Raymonde Saint-Germain: Would you take a question, Senator Gold?

Hon. Marc Gold (Government Representative in the Senate): Thank you, senator, for your question. The government is very aware of the serious situation that’s posed by flooding and mudslides in British Columbia, as well as the impact on transportation networks and supply chains.

Transport Canada, I’m advised, is optimistic about the news of rail lines gradually restarting, and with key industry partners and members of federal and provincial governments, the Government of Canada has formed a joint Supply Chain Recovery Working Group to assess transport networks and plan for the prioritized movement of goods. I have been informed that the government continues to work closely with these partners to address the broader supply chain issues going forward.

Senator Gold: Thank you. That is a very good question, and I appreciate it.

My understanding is that from a technical infrastructure point of view, we share resources with the House of Commons. Therefore, our ability to chart our own course independently of what is happening in the other place is somewhat constrained.

My understanding, Senator Batters, is that at any given time there can be a limited number of hybrid committee meetings. That is why when the Committee of Selection, sometime in the course of the last Parliament, recommended and the Senate approved the system, it was to allow for completely virtual committee sittings so as to allow more of our committees, more of the time, to do the important work that we do here in the chamber.

Hon. Ratna Omidvar: My question is for Senator Gold, the Leader of the Government in the Senate.

My question, Senator Gold is about Afghanistan and our obligations to those who are in danger because they worked alongside Canadian Forces, Canadian NGOs, journalists and activists. Now they are in danger and Canadians believe it is our moral imperative to bring them to safety.

However, the government’s good intentions — and I want to grant that the government does have good intentions — must be followed through with execution and implementation. By all accounts, we are failing significantly on that front.

Why is the government not taking a leaf out of the Syrian refugee playbook? If there is a key lesson to take forward from our response from that time, it is this: A deadline serves all parts of the system, political and bureaucratic, to get to the finish line.

When will the government outline a detailed plan, with timelines, to bring Afghan refugees to Canada?

Hon. Marc Gold (Government Representative in the Senate): Thank you for your question. The government is very much preoccupied with this situation, as are our allies and partners around the world. Canada continues to discuss this issue with our partners to ensure that decisions that are made are both effective and coordinated.

Hon. Marc Gold (Government Representative in the Senate): Thank you for your question.

The devastation in British Columbia touches us all. The Canadian government has responded quickly to the calls of the B.C. government for assistance — much of which has been reported in the newspaper — military presence and financial aid.

I will make inquiries with regard to specific aid to those farmers who are suffering grievous damage as a result of this disaster and report back as quickly as I can.

Hon. Marc Gold (Government Representative in the Senate): Thank you for the question. I have inquired but have not yet received an answer from the government. I will share the answer as soon as I receive it.

As for when we will have an opportunity to question the Minister of Finance, I hope that this chamber will continue regularly inviting ministers for question period. The parliamentary groups will be discussing this topic in the coming weeks. I also hope that we will soon be able to invite ministers, including the Minister of Finance, to answer this question and any others that come up.

[English]

Hon. Marc Gold (Government Representative in the Senate): Thank you, senator, for the question.

It is my understanding that Finance Canada has previously engaged with the office of the honourable senator in order to try to provide clarification on this matter. I have been assured by the government that there will be no impact on the benefits paid or to be paid to Canadian seniors arising from the issue that had been identified following parliamentary approval of Bill C-30.

I would also point out that Bill C-30 was the subject of a robust Senate pre-study involving six committees and that Division 31 of the bill, dealing with OAS increases, was studied extensively by the Senate’s Social Affairs Committee. The government remains focused on the successful implementation of increases to Old Age Security both in terms of short-term support through one-time payments, followed by the permanent 10% increase to monthly OAS pensions for seniors aged 75 and older beginning in July 2022.

Senator Ataullahjan: Senator Gold, for four months now we have been receiving desperate emails and phone calls from Afghans trying to flee Kabul and from Canadians concerned about their loved ones.

Besides fearing for their lives, they are also struggling with poverty. The UN currently estimates that nearly half the country’s population, 24 million people, is now facing acute hunger. As a result, child marriage is on the rise. Also, the selling of female children has begun. There was an instance where a father was trying to sell his daughter for $300, and he was told that the price of an Afghan life has gone down to $110.

Senator Gold, what is the government’s plan to alleviate this humanitarian crisis?

Hon. Marc Gold (Government Representative in the Senate), pursuant to notice of November 23, 2021, moved:

That, notwithstanding any provision of the Rules, previous order or usual practice:

1.as soon as practicable after the adoption of this order the Senate begin to hold hybrid sittings, with all senators able to participate in sittings either from the Senate Chamber or through an approved videoconference technology to be determined from time to time by the Speaker after consulting with the leaders and facilitators, with the provisions of this order applying until hybrid sittings cease, and during the time this order is in effect, the Senate Administration continue to implement a system to allow senators in the Senate Chamber to see, on screen, the senators participating by videoconference;

2.the Speaker, after consulting the leaders and facilitators, determine the date on which such hybrid sittings shall commence;

3.hybrid sittings of the Senate be considered, for all purposes, proceedings of the Senate, with senators participating in such sittings by videoconference from a designated office or designated residence within Canada being considered, for all purposes, including quorum, present at the sitting; the sitting being considered to take place in the parliamentary precinct; and times specified in the Rules or this or any other order being Ottawa times;

4.subject to variations that may be required by the circumstances, to participate in hybrid sittings of the Senate by videoconference senators must:

(a)use a desktop or laptop computer and headset with integrated microphone provided by the Senate for videoconferences;

(b)not use other devices such as personal tablets or smartphones;

(c)be the only people visible on the videoconference from an active video feed, other than those in the Senate Chamber; and

(d)except while the bells are ringing for a vote:

(i)have their video on and broadcasting their image at all times; and

(ii)leave the videoconference if they leave their seat;

5.the Senate recognize that, except as provided in this order, there should generally be parity of treatment among all senators attending in person and those attending by videoconference during hybrid sittings of the Senate and that proceedings should follow usual procedures, subject to such variations required for technical reasons as may be directed by the Speaker, subject to appeal to the Senate if technically feasible;

6.senators participating in hybrid sittings of the Senate by videoconference need not stand;

7.without restricting the operation of rule 3-6 and the right of senators to move a motion to adjourn the Senate as allowed under the Rules, without affecting requirements in certain circumstances that the Senate continue sitting after receipt of a message from the Crown or the announcement that a message is anticipated, and except as otherwise provided in this order:

(a)when the Senate sits on a Monday, the provisions of rule 3-3(1) be suspended and the sitting:

(i)start at 6 p.m.; and

(ii)adjourn at the earlier of the end of Government Business or 9 p.m.;

(b)when the Senate sits on a Tuesday, the sitting:

(i)start at 2 p.m.; and

(ii)adjourn at the earlier of the end of business for the day or 9 p.m.;

(c)when the Senate sits on a Wednesday, the sitting:

(i)start at 2 p.m.; and

(ii)adjourn at the earlier of the end of Government Business or 4 p.m.;

(d)when the Senate sits on a Thursday, the sitting:

(i)start at 2 p.m.; and

(ii)adjourn at the earlier of the end of business for the day or 9 p.m.; and

(e)when the Senate sits on a Friday, the sitting:

(i)start at 10 a.m.; and

(ii)adjourn at the earlier of the end of Government Business or 4 p.m.;

8.the Speaker be authorized to suspend the sitting of the Senate as required for technical and other reasons, and the microphones of senators participating by videoconference shall be muted during any suspension;

9.the Speaker be authorized to direct that the sitting of the Senate be adjourned for technical reasons, provided that this direction be subject to appeal if technically feasible;

10.the times provided for adjournment of the sitting in paragraph 7 be considered the ordinary time of adjournment for the purposes of the Rules, and, for greater certainty, any provisions of the Rules permitting the continuation of the sitting beyond that time in certain circumstances continue to apply, provided that if the provisions of paragraph 9 are invoked when an item that would allow the Senate to continue beyond the ordinary time of adjournment is under consideration, that item of business shall, except in the case of an emergency debate and subject to the provisions of rule 4-13(3), be dealt with at the start of the Orders of the Day of the next following sitting;

11.on the first day of debate on a motion moved in relation to a case of privilege, debate may be adjourned, even if normally prohibited under rule 13-6(6);

12.the evening suspension provided for in rule 3-3(1) end at 7 p.m.;

13.when the Senate sits on a day other than a Friday, any provision of the Rules requiring that something take place at 8 p.m. be read as if the time therein were 7 p.m.;

14.the Senate recognize the importance of providing the Speaker with information necessary to allow him to assist with the orderly conduct of business in hybrid sittings, and therefore, subject to normal confidentiality practices, strongly encourage all senators:

(a)to advise their party or group representatives, or the Clerk of the Senate or his delegate, as far in advance as possible, if they intend to intervene during the sitting; and

(b)to provide the Clerk of the Senate or his delegate, as far in advance as possible with an electronic copy in English and French of any amendment, subamendment, notice of motion, notice of inquiry, committee report to be tabled or presented, bill to be introduced, or any other document required for the sitting as far in advance as possible;

15.a senator who has provided an advance copy of a document under subparagraph 14(b) be considered to have fulfilled any obligation to provide a signed copy of that document;

16.the following provisions have effect in relation to voting during hybrid sittings of the Senate:

(a)only senators present in the Senate Chamber shall participate in:

(i)the procedure for a voice vote; and

(ii)the determination as to whether leave is granted for bells of less than 60 minutes;

(b)to be one of the senators requesting a standing vote, a senator participating by videoconference must clearly indicate this request, but need not stand;

(c)rule 9-7(1)(c) shall be read as follows:

“(c) then:

(i) ask the “yeas” in the Senate Chamber to rise for their names to be called;

(ii) ask the “yeas” participating by videoconference to hold up the established card for voting “yea” for their names to be called;

(iii) ask the “nays” in the Senate Chamber to rise for their names to be called;

(iv) ask the “nays” participating by videoconference to hold up the established card for voting “nay” for their names to be called;

(v) ask those who are abstaining in the Senate Chamber to rise for their names to be called; and

(vi) ask those who are abstaining and participating by videoconference to hold up the established card for abstaining for their names to be called.”;

(d)when a standing vote is underway, senators participating by videoconference must have their camera on for the duration of the vote and each senator must be seen on camera when voting;

(e)except as provided in subparagraph (h), if a vote is deferred pursuant to rule 9-10, it shall be held at 3:30 p.m. on the next day the Senate sits, after a 15-minute bell, interrupting any proceedings then underway, except another vote or the bells for a vote;

(f)except as provided in subparagraph (h), if a vote is deferred pursuant to rule 4-6(1), it shall be held at 3:30 p.m. on the same day, after a 15‑minute bell, interrupting any proceedings then underway, except another vote or the bells for a vote;

(g)except as provided in subparagraph (h), in the case of votes deferred pursuant to other provisions of the Rules, the usual processes for such votes shall hold, with the sitting being suspended, if necessary, at the end of the time otherwise provided for the end of the sitting pursuant to this order; and

(h)if a deferred vote is to be held on a Monday, it shall be held at the end of Question Period, after a 15-minute bell;

17.for greater certainty, leave be considered granted during hybrid sittings of the Senate when requested, unless the Speaker, after a sufficient period of time, hears an objection from a senator, either in the Senate Chamber or participating by videoconference;

18.from the time of the adoption of this order:

(a)any return, report or other paper deposited with the Clerk of the Senate pursuant to rule 14-1(6), may be deposited electronically;

(b)the government be authorized to deposit electronically with the Clerk of the Senate any documents relating to its administrative responsibilities, following the process of rule 14-1(6);

(c)written replies to oral questions and to written questions may be deposited with the Clerk of the Senate electronically following the process of rule 14-1(6), provided that written replies to oral questions be published as an appendix to the Debates of the Senate of the day on which the tabling is recorded in the Journals of the Senate; and

(d)written replies to oral questions deposited electronically with the Clerk of the Senate shall be distributed to all senators;

19.from the time of the adoption of this order, Senate committees have the power to hold hybrid meetings;

20.for greater certainty, and without limiting the general authority granted by this order, when a committee holds a hybrid meeting:

(a)members of the committee participating count towards quorum;

(b)such meetings be considered to be occurring in the parliamentary precinct, irrespective of where participants may be; and

(c)the committee be directed to approach in camera meetings with the utmost caution and all necessary precautions, taking account of the risks to the confidentiality of in camera proceedings inherent in such technologies;

21.subject to variations that may be required by the circumstances, to participate in a committee meeting by videoconference senators must:

(a)participate from a designated office or designated residence within Canada;

(b)use a desktop or laptop computer and a headset with integrated microphone provided by the Senate for videoconferences;

(c)not use other devices, such as personal tablets or smartphones;

(d)be the only people visible on the videoconference;

(e)have their video on and broadcasting their image at all times; and

(f)leave the videoconference if they leave their seat;

22.if a committee holds a hybrid meeting in public, the provisions of rule 14-7(2) be applied so as to allow recording or broadcasting through any facilities arranged by the Clerk of the Senate, and, if such a meeting cannot be broadcast live, the committee be considered to have fulfilled any obligations under the Rules relating to public meetings by making any available recording publicly available as soon as possible thereafter; and

23.the terms of this order cease to have effect, and hybrid sittings of the Senate and hybrid meetings of Senate committees cease, at the end of the day on March 31, 2022.

He said: Honourable senators, I rise today to speak briefly to Government Motion No. 2, which re-establishes hybrid sittings of this chamber, including our committees, based on provisions that were in place and agreed to during the last Parliament. Thanks to the work of the Senate Administration, which helped operationalize this system, colleagues from all corners of the country were able to take part in deliberations related to the Senate’s proceedings.

While the situation was different at the outbreak of the pandemic and for months afterward, I would respectfully submit that the current situation is still tenuous for a variety of reasons and, for some, participating at a distance, virtually, remains the appropriate option.

[Translation]

Although mandatory vaccine requirements are in place for employees and guests on Parliament Hill, including in the Senate Chamber, the number of cases of COVID-19 here in Ontario and in many provinces in Canada remains high. As winter approaches, activities are moving indoors, which seems to be contributing to a new spike in cases.

[English]

I am incredibly grateful to our healthcare professionals, our workers, our public health officials and scientific experts here in Canada who have accelerated the vaccination effort.

However, as a professional and responsible workplace, the Senate of Canada must remain vigilant. We need to be honest with ourselves about the grim reality that our country continues to face.

Our jobs require us to commute back and forth to Ottawa from our regions situated across this vast country. For many of us, our homes are a flight or two away, a walk through crowded airports and many hours from our destination. Having to make this journey every week, for two or three weeks each month, is quite frankly tempting fate.

There may be colleagues amongst us whose health or an underlying medical condition puts them in a vulnerable category. This doesn’t mean, however, that they are unable to do their jobs. It means they should have the option of not travelling to Ottawa when we have the means for them to join us virtually.

[Translation]

Some of us may live with or take care of an aging relative or a person who is immunocompromised, and with the holiday season around the corner, many of us will be spending time with our children, our grandchildren or our loved ones, who are also vulnerable.

Colleagues, last year, the Senate worked hard to bring in a hybrid system so that senators across the country could fully participate in the daily sittings, the important debates and the votes, and, just as importantly, senators were able to attend committee meetings virtually.

[English]

The global pandemic may have shuttered the doors of this chamber to all but a few, but it did not halt the legislative agenda that moved through Parliament and assisted those individual Canadians and Canadian businesses who so desperately needed assistance and support to weather this storm. We performed our duty last Parliament and we did so with the input and participation of our colleagues from as far away as the Yukon, northern Alberta and Prince Edward Island.

As we commence this new Parliament, no one should be prevented from participating in their constitutionally mandated duties when we have the wherewithal to provide a viable and proven option.

This motion and the ability for some to work virtually in a hybrid setting is not for the long term. While the motion contains an expiry date of March 31, 2022, should the situation improve between now and then, and colleagues feel confident based on their own personal circumstances that travel to Ottawa does not pose a threat to themselves or their loved ones, then senators will have the opportunity to do so.

We must keep in mind provincial parameters and the possibility of restrictions being imposed by individual provinces should their case counts reach unacceptable levels.

[Translation]

Nevertheless, if the state of public health deteriorates or remains unstable, I hope that we can re-evaluate the circumstances collectively and responsibly to ensure that we have prudent measures in place to protect senators, our staff and the entire Senate family.

[English]

Until that time, I submit that it is incumbent upon us to do all possible in allowing for the participation and inclusion of colleagues who, for whatever reason, must join us virtually.

I ask all honourable senators present to support this motion in this unprecedented time and permit senators to fulfill their constitutional duties regardless of their physical location in the country. As we continue to grapple with the harsh realities of COVID-19, we must continue to deploy all means necessary to protect ourselves and those around us.

Honourable senators, to me this motion is about ensuring that the Senate is a safe, compassionate and inclusive workplace. I hope that you will support this motion so that all senators are able to participate without fear of putting their health and safety and those of others at risk. I thank you.

Senator Gold: Thank you for the question and for reminding us of how things have changed since the pandemic.

Let me note for the record, if I may begin with this, that the motion before us with the language to which you referred was the by-product of extensive consultations with the leaders of all groups.

All leaders knew and understood that we were re-establishing the provisions of the hybrid motion which were in place during the Forty-third Parliament, which includes how the Wednesday sittings operate.

I also understand and am pleased that there is a strong desire by all groups to have committees established as soon as possible. I’m hopeful that committees will be operational soon.

The reality of hybrid sittings and committees is that we do not have the technical abilities to have the Senate and multiple committees operating at the same time.

I would respectfully submit that it would be unwise to put ourselves in a position where this chamber would be required to seek leave for a committee to meet if the Senate is still discussing government business in the chamber, because this might put a committee in a situation where it cannot meet if leave is denied, even if there is important government legislation before it.

More importantly, these provisions as drafted would secure committee spots and meeting times that I expect would be in place on Wednesdays.

It’s important, colleagues, that we ensure that our committees are organized, that meeting times are respected. We’ve all had the experience of being members of committees, having invited witnesses — some who come from afar and at great inconvenience — who are forced to wait and sometimes cannot even appear because the times in the chamber have been such that the committees can’t meet. I believe that the provisions in the current motion, as existed in the previous hybrid motions, remain the appropriate course of action.

Now to your question — and you’ll forgive me for that, but I wanted to put that on the record — in any circumstances, we as a chamber have the ability to be flexible. You can rest assured that our office will continue to remain flexible if circumstances so require.

For the moment, we’re satisfied that this motion before us is the right way to proceed in a hybrid sitting.

Thank you for your question.

Senator Gold: Yes.

Senator Gold: I deeply regret the need to rise, but I’m grateful for the opportunity to agree with you and thank you for your support for the hybrid motion for all of the honourable senators from Newfoundland and Labrador.

[Translation]