44th Parl. 1st Sess.
March 3, 2022 10:00AM
- Mar/3/22 10:30:38 a.m.
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Madam Speaker, I appreciate my hon. colleague's question.
The European Union is also obsessed with pipelines. I have a document here from 2015 that says that pipeline policy is a concern not only for the economy, but also for Europe's security and its expenditures. I encourage my colleague to read this document.
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- Mar/3/22 1:47:07 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, I thank my incredible colleague for Sarnia—Lambton for that question.
The member is right, as I am sure she has also read the report from the EU, which states that eastern Europe needs to move beyond its energy dependence on Russia. My colleague is exactly on track with her line of thinking as well as with the EU.
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- Mar/3/22 1:57:11 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, I welcome the conversation and discussion. I agree that it needs to be had.
However, I do not believe that the issue of energy independence and the issue of our ability to use our natural gas to support other good actors in the world and other democratic nations in Europe are separate. I think this is actually key and critical, because the dependence of Europe on natural gas puts Europe in a difficult position. I think these issues are completely intertwined, but I look forward to a further conversation.
I am wondering if the hon. member could comment on that.
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- Mar/3/22 1:57:48 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, I agree with my colleague. When we look at the situation Germany was in, given its reliance on Russian natural gas and the complete foreign policy change Germany has taken, which is fundamentally a change, there are vulnerabilities to our allies in the world regarding food security and energy security. For colleagues like me, who agree on the need to transition to a low-carbon economy, that also includes critical minerals. The European Union imports 98% of critical minerals from China. When we look at that dynamic, we ask what our role is in the western world to provide the tools that are going to be necessary to transition to a low-carbon economy, and also what our role is in providing the fuel that is going to be necessary to get Europe through the next five to 10 years, given the uncertainties we are seeing in eastern Europe.
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- Mar/3/22 1:59:15 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, I have looked at and watched the proceedings of the European Parliament. When we actually look at the chancellor in Germany, that country has just invested in two LNG facilities to be able to backstop the fact that they know there is going to be energy insecurity. Am I in support of making a transition? I absolutely am, but let us not mistake that Europe is asking not only for energy on a transitional basis for the next five to 10 years, but also for the critical minerals that are going to be important to make the transition my hon. colleague is talking about. They are both extremely important. It is that nuance. It is not black or white; it is gray and in the middle. We have to be there on both accounts.
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- Mar/3/22 2:38:26 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, given the brutal invasion of Ukraine, European countries have very much made clear their decision to end dependence on Russian oil and gas. European countries have made it clear, including during this week's International Energy Agency ministerial meeting, of the pressing need for Europe to accelerate the transition to renewables and hydrogen.
We are conferring and working closely with our allies on short- and long-term options for stabilizing and ensuring access to a long-term energy supply. I am engaged directly with our American and European counterparts, and we are steadfast in our support for Ukraine and our European allies.
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- Mar/3/22 2:40:47 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, we, and certainly European countries, would agree that the dependence on Russian oil and gas is a significant problem for Europe that it must move to address. European ministers have made that commitment, including at the International Energy Agency ministerial meeting I participated in earlier this week.
We are working very actively with our European colleagues and with our American colleagues to ensure we are working to help address both short and long-term energy supply issues in the context that Europe and Canada have committed to do, which is in the context of fighting both the crisis in Europe and the crisis of climate change.
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- Mar/3/22 4:01:11 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, when I think about the things I have heard, when I have been there in eastern Europe and had an opportunity to speak to those people who are looking at their own physical security, I think that is really the critical aspect of this. I know what has happened in order to stop pipelines going through Ukraine, which is the reason the Nord Stream projects were there and the reason that Germany decided it would be able to bypass the pipeline, but it would be $2 billion a year that Ukraine would not get. Those are the types of things I am talking about, when I say there are actors out there who are making this difficult for everyone. I do not blame those who are environmentalists for saying they want to have something better, because I 100% agree with that as a process. I just want it to be fair and balanced, and I do not want it come from foreign countries trying to protect their own interests.
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- Mar/3/22 4:12:30 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, as I said, there is an immediate energy need in Europe, and 31 countries are coming together to release strategic oil reserves to help the European Union get through this difficult period. Oil is part of the energy mix. It is central to the functioning of economies, but we are in a transition and the motion talks about a time far away from today. The energy mix is bound to change.
In terms of individual projects, they are subject to environmental assessments and a whole process of decision-making. I cannot really comment on the particular reserves that the member is referring to.
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- Mar/3/22 4:27:52 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, it will take several years to build gas and oil pipelines to Europe. Also, in any case, oil and gas are energies of the past. Hydroelectricity, solar power, wind power and other clean energies are the future.
Can we not agree that, if we really want to help people in Ukraine and our European friends, we should send them energies of the future and not the old stuff, which is already not working and will work even less in four, five or ten years?
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- Mar/3/22 4:45:01 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, that was another great question.
Sadly, our allies in central and eastern Europe were far more aware of the dangers of Russia than our friends in western Europe, and in fact, even too many in the foreign policy establishment here in Canada, but we can move today. We cannot undo what was done but we can move forward.
There is a proposal in Newfoundland and Labrador to take advantage of their natural gas resources, which would be the closest point to Europe and the best partner for Europe to meet some of its needs for natural gas. As well, the large LNG facility in Saint John, New Brunswick, is currently an import facility. There are plans to reverse it so that it will be an export facility. Again, it is closer to Europe than other points on the Atlantic coast.
We should move forward as partners with Europe, taking full advantage of our strategic resources to ensure that our allies are strong and protected, and that countries like Russia are not able to threaten them and weaken their positions because they supply resources and places like Canada do not.
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- Mar/3/22 4:58:47 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, I think my view is well known in the House. It is that I do not think it should take 10 years to move these kinds of projects forward. We need a process in this country that allows us to build critical infrastructure more quickly, and we have presented proposals along those lines.
I have to disagree with the implication of the member's question that energy security is not a problem. The European Union has said repeatedly that energy security is a problem. Different politicians with different perspectives in Europe would have different proposed solutions, but I think there is an agreement across the political spectrum that energy security is critically important. It is easy to take that security for granted here in Canada, but in places around the world that do not have the same domestic capacity to produce energy resources, it is a huge problem.
As for saying that Europe can rely on countries in the Middle East as opposed to Russia, there are multiple potential security challenges. For Canada as a free democracy with high environmental standards to be exporting energy resources to relieve our European friends' dependency on countries that are not democratic is a smart move for global security and is good for the environment.
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- Mar/3/22 5:10:06 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, it is not realistic to think that hot air balloons filled with natural gas will be departing for Europe tomorrow. I understand that my colleague is asking whether this idea has some potential in the long term.
The answer is unfortunately no, because we need to think about transitioning in the long term.
Even if it were possible and realistic in the long term, would it be something we would want to do? I do not think so. I think we have moved on.
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