44th Parl. 1st Sess.
March 3, 2022 10:00AM
- Mar/3/22 10:30:38 a.m.
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Madam Speaker, I appreciate my hon. colleague's question.
The European Union is also obsessed with pipelines. I have a document here from 2015 that says that pipeline policy is a concern not only for the economy, but also for Europe's security and its expenditures. I encourage my colleague to read this document.
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- Mar/3/22 11:10:46 a.m.
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Madam Speaker, I am absolutely appalled to see the Conservatives' use of talking about children going hungry as a reason for us to spend billions on a pipeline. We are dealing with a world crisis of people dying in the streets, being killed, and they see this as another reason to turn on the taps of taxpayer money.
We have spent $121 billion in subsidies to big oil in the last seven years, $75 billion on carbon capture, $21 billion on TMX and $1 billion on the abandoned wells, and the Conservatives are talking about using a humanitarian crisis for more.
Will the Liberals agree with us that this motion is undermining Canada's reputation of standing up for Ukraine because the Conservatives are more interested in satisfying big oil?
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- Mar/3/22 11:23:17 a.m.
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Madam Speaker, first, it does not take a pipeline to send fertilizer to Ukraine.
Second, German Chancellor Olaf Scholz himself says that Germany should reduce its dependence on oil and start transitioning to green energy as soon as possible. The Conservatives are offering to sell him more oil. However, that is not what is needed. The Germans themselves are saying this is not the direction they should take.
Why would we not heed the advice of our European allies in the context of this crisis and provide them what they need to begin the green transition? Quebec is especially well placed to help in that regard.
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- Mar/3/22 11:26:12 a.m.
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Madam Speaker, I am not surprised the Liberals are coming out to support the Conservatives. They have had 6,800 backroom meetings with big oil, and there have been more oil subsidies under the Liberals than under the Stephen Harper government.
I want to ask my hon. colleague a quick question. I have seen the map of Canada. To get a pipeline from Alberta to the Atlantic it has to cross Quebec, which has just cancelled the Saguenay pipeline because it undermines our international Paris obligations. Does the hon. member think the Liberals and the Conservatives are going to force Quebec to put the new pipeline through?
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- Mar/3/22 11:26:48 a.m.
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Madam President, that is an excellent question.
We saw the Liberal government force B.C.'s government to agree to let a pipeline cross its province. Quebec is fundamentally and irrevocably opposed to a new pipeline going through. I hope that our Liberal colleagues are not suggesting that they are prepared to force a pipeline down Quebeckers' throats.
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- Mar/3/22 12:05:57 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, I did not know they built the pipeline in 1854 to deal with the food crisis in Ukraine, but again, the Conservatives will tell us anything. We start with this being a big oil and gas issue, but as soon as we poke them, they start talking about children being hungry.
We do not carry nitrogen in pipelines. This is about oil and gas. This is a simple fact. For my hon. colleague who wants to go back to 1854, we can go back throughout history. They were not using pipelines to deliver agricultural support and they still are not. Once again, we see the Conservatives using a humanitarian disaster and a humanitarian crisis to promote the false interests of the oil and gas sector.
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- Mar/3/22 12:10:42 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, if we look at what is happening in Europe now, the discussion is clearly about the need to get off Russian energy. They are talking about doing this through improving the electricity grids and making sure that their non-renewable and nuclear options are in place.
I do not see any of that from this Conservative party, a party that is trying to exploit a humanitarian crisis right now, at this time, in order to sell this false pipe dream that we could in six months, a year or two years, build a pipeline from the west to Atlantic Canada to capture a market, when there are already at least 12 other LNG projects sitting on the sidelines across North America and the European stock in clean energy is going up. All of this is predicated on the usual Conservative scheme of saying, “Let us take billions in taxpayers' money and try to drive it through.”
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- Mar/3/22 1:15:18 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, as we know, things move quickly in politics, and that can cause confusion.
A former Liberal leader wants to run in the Conservative leadership race. Now, we have learned that, according to the Liberals and the member for Winnipeg North, the Conservative motion is no good because it seeks to build a pipeline to export natural gas to Europe.
Can my colleague from Winnipeg North explain to me why it is a bad idea to build a pipeline to export natural gas to Europe, but it is a good idea to build the Trans Mountain pipeline to export oil abroad?
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- Mar/3/22 3:33:43 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, I know that all of us in the House, as my colleague mentioned, are standing in support of Ukraine and, hopefully, moving toward peace. I found it very cynical that the official opposition decided to take this time when people are literally fleeing for their lives to make the issue about a pipeline debate.
I am wondering if she could share some of her thoughts about that.
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- Mar/3/22 4:01:11 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, when I think about the things I have heard, when I have been there in eastern Europe and had an opportunity to speak to those people who are looking at their own physical security, I think that is really the critical aspect of this. I know what has happened in order to stop pipelines going through Ukraine, which is the reason the Nord Stream projects were there and the reason that Germany decided it would be able to bypass the pipeline, but it would be $2 billion a year that Ukraine would not get. Those are the types of things I am talking about, when I say there are actors out there who are making this difficult for everyone. I do not blame those who are environmentalists for saying they want to have something better, because I 100% agree with that as a process. I just want it to be fair and balanced, and I do not want it come from foreign countries trying to protect their own interests.
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- Mar/3/22 4:13:25 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, we hope and expect that this war will not last forever.
Since the gas pipeline that could be built to help Ukraine will never be finished or operational in time to actually do any good, does the hon. member agree with me that the project would not only be useless, but could even cause harm?
A number of Russian oligarchs have interests in Canadian oil companies and in some of the companies that produce materials that could be used to build the gas pipeline.
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- Mar/3/22 4:41:10 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, I would like to thank my colleague for his speech.
I understand that one of the Conservatives’ main arguments is to make sure that Putin is not financed because the world is still purchasing its products. We know that Europe is relatively dependent, and that Germany is 50% dependent.
Also, when you talk about Canada supplying Europe, it is important to remember that Russian oligarchs have interests in Canadian oil companies and that the construction of gas pipelines could serve the interests of some of these oligarchs, in particular those invested in the steel industry.
I am wholeheartedly against the idea of building a gas pipeline. However, for argument’s sake, what would my colleague think about amending the proposal to systematically exclude all Canadian companies that, directly or indirectly, have Russian interests?
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