Senator Boniface: They said it would be somewhere in between. It is novel. However, when you refer to other countries, let me also say that in the United States, in the United Kingdom and in Australia, the threshold is actually lower than what Canada is putting in here in its place. When we compare this to some of our like jurisdictions, this is actually a higher standard than exists in other jurisdictions.

That is an important question and that is why I said at the end of my speech that the committee that has the privilege to look at this bill needs to ask these questions. It is a unique circumstance at the border. Devices are unique in terms of the time frame that border officers have to look at them and to make their decisions. I think how they built in some of the accountability for officers is an important mechanism that helps us flesh it out. There is no doubt that the courts will have to look at this at some point; it will be challenged, and they will have to look at it. I am extremely hopeful that we will be in a position where we recognize the balance that must be taken in this case. I encourage those at the committee that sees this to make sure you ask those questions.

Senator Boniface: Thank you very much, Senator Wells, for your question, which very much aligns with Senator Omidvar’s question. I want to be clear that the “reasonable general concern” is legislated but not as high as “reasonable grounds.” To be clear, that is the difference. In fact, prior to Canfield, there was no threshold requirement; it was part of a routine search. I want to make sure that is clear.

You raise the same question that Senator Omidvar spoke to on the indicators. As I said, this is the work that CBSA officers do every day. They may ask you a question, not knowing you are Senator Wells, such as, “What do you have with you? What’s on your phone?” for instance. You may indicate, “nothing.” Then they will question further to see if they can get some indicators. They look for issues like avoidance in answering the questions. They look for people who are nervous.

It is important to remember that they work in this environment every day, so they take into consideration whether you have an explanation for the way you are acting or the way that you appear. They are professional in what they do. They are trained to look for this type of thing. The fact that they have to make notes around the personal devices is an important step in terms of any challenges they may have but also to ensure that, as they do this over time — which isn’t that often, as you can tell from the statistics — they will become very good at it. It is important to remember that this is what they do every day; it is not unique to this.