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Mr. Michael Kram (Regina—Wascana, CPC)

Feb/28/22 8:37:47 p.m.
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Mr. Chair, Vladimir Putin needs to understand that his invasion of Ukraine is totally unacceptable, and Russia needs to become a pariah on the world stage, just like North Korea. Will the government expel the Russian ambassador to Canada and at the same time recall Canada's ambassador to Russia?

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Mr. Anthony Housefather

Feb/28/22 8:38:10 p.m.
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Mr. Chair, as the hon. member knows, I do not speak for the government on this issue. However, in my view, that would depend on whether or not we believe the Canadian ambassador in Russia, who would clearly be expelled if we expelled the Russian ambassador, is able to find things out on the ground that we need to know. I have no personal objection to strongly considering the expulsion of the ambassador, but I think there are other things we need to do that are far more important, such as making sure that sanctions are imposed in the strongest manner against Russia and making sure there is so much pressure that Russians try to overthrow Putin. Finally, I am in agreement that Russia should not be part of international organizations as long as the Putin regime is in place.

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Mr. Maxime Blanchette-Joncas (Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques, BQ)

Feb/28/22 8:39:08 p.m.
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Mr. Chair, I thank my colleague from Mount Royal for his speech. I listened carefully to my colleague and I heard him say the word “cybersecurity”. In the past few days, Aluminerie Alouette, which is based in Sept-Îles, was the victim of an attack and it is suspected that Russia was involved. Is the government prepared to face this type of attacks? What will it do in future?

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Mr. Anthony Housefather

Feb/28/22 8:39:31 p.m.
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Mr. Chair, I thank my hon. colleague for his question. Yes, the government is prepared. The Minister of National Defence answered a question today about cybersecurity. We absolutely recognize that we must protect government bodies but also all bodies and institutions across the country. Russia is absolutely engaging in cyber-attacks and we must be prepared. That is why, yesterday, I proposed increasing funding so we can better deal with these kinds of situations.

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Ms. Laurel Collins (Victoria, NDP)

Feb/28/22 8:40:15 p.m.
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Mr. Chair, it is great to see MPs across party lines united in their support for Ukraine and united in their condemnation of Putin. That is not the case everywhere. The member mentioned Donald Trump in his speech. It is appalling to see the former U.S. president praising Putin. Putin's government has a track record of using disinformation to target democracies. My question is about how disinformation has been used by Putin and by his regime to destabilize, to undermine support for Ukraine and to justify this unjustifiable war. Could the member speak to what the government needs to do to combat disinformation online, on social media and in our communities?

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Mr. Anthony Housefather

Feb/28/22 8:40:59 p.m.
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Mr. Chair, we need to make sure that platforms are held accountable for driving traffic to disinformation. We have seen, over and over, that platforms seek to monetize and make revenue and make sure that people stay on platforms for as long as possible. Hate is driven to hate, and people who believe in one world theory are driven to other conspiracy theories that they would agree with, keeping them on a platform longer. We need to make sure that platforms are not allowed to continue to do that. We also need to make sure that disinformation is not only flagged but removed when it poses a threat to a nation's security. I think Russia has been the most culpable, but there are other foreign threats in this regard, and we need to take this very seriously.

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Mr. Mike Morrice (Kitchener Centre, GP)

Feb/28/22 8:41:50 p.m.
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Mr. Chair, I thank the member for Mount Royal for his always unifying tone. One thing we have heard tonight from a lot of parliamentarians is the call to waive visa requirements for those fleeing violence. I wonder if the member would mind sharing his personal views on the importance of doing so.

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Mr. Anthony Housefather

Feb/28/22 8:42:13 p.m.
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Mr. Chair, I think it would be appropriate to thank Poland and all the neighbouring countries around Ukraine for taking in so many refugees. We certainly have to make it easy for Ukrainians who are seeking a temporary or permanent solution to come to Canada. I am certainly open to any suggestions that would make it easier for Ukrainians to come to Canada.

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Mr. Kody Blois (Kings—Hants, Lib.)

Feb/28/22 8:42:36 p.m.
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Mr. Chair, it is an absolute privilege to be here tonight, albeit I just have five minutes to talk about a subject that is much more nuanced than time allows. I will try to make my remarks proportionate to what we have seen. I would like to thank the member for Etobicoke Centre and other colleagues in the House who pushed for this debate. It is extremely important and timely that we are having it right now. I will join the chorus of my colleagues in the House, indeed individuals around the world, in condemning and denouncing Russia's egregious attack on Ukraine. It is unjust. It is unprovoked. Indeed it is against international law. This is the largest mobilization of state-to-state warfare we have seen in Europe in decades. It marks a very nuanced and challenging point vis-à-vis the Cold War. I am 31 years old. I was born in 1991, right at the time the Soviet Union was collapsing, and this of course is very pronounced in the last 31 years that we have seen this. The images have been horrific. I do not know if words give justice to what we have seen. It has been horrific but also inspirational at the same time. It is horrific in the sense that we have seen civilians killed. We have seen beautiful, peaceful cities which just a few days ago were not dealing with this now being bombarded with Russian missiles and bombs and with soldiers on the ground. It is beautiful in the sense of how we have seen the Ukrainian people come together in their resistance under the leadership of President Zelensky. Everyday Ukrainians are banding together in such a unified fashion to fight for their democracy and their freedom. It is truly, in every sense, incredible and inspiring. I am going to take a quick moment to talk about the Government of Canada's response. It would be difficult to find someone in this House who does not support what the government has done to date. Indeed, there are calls for us to do more, which are warranted. As the situation continues to evolve, we will continue to need to do even more for the Ukrainian people, whether it be providing lethal and non-lethal weapons or imposing economic sanctions, which we saw today are continuing to have an impact on the Russian Federation. The price of the ruble is dropping significantly. The fact that we have worked to limit the central bank from having any access to SWIFT and those global payments is doing important work. It will not change the dynamic overnight, but it will be an important piece. I want to take the last two minutes I have to talk about the fact that not only do we need to continue to support Ukraine but we also need to recognize this is a change in foreign policy around the world. As I mentioned previously, this is the end of the post Cold War period. No one has a crystal ball to see where things may go, but the fact that Russia and China signed an agreement just four weeks ago, the fact that China did not vote against the Russian invasion as being contrary to the principles under the United Nations signals and access, should have all parliamentarians and Canadians mindful of that dynamic from a geopolitical sense. Like other colleagues have done, I want to provide some recommendations that I think will be important for all us as parliamentarians, and indeed the government, to consider in the days ahead. One is looking at Canada's propensity to feed and fuel the world. I come from a riding that is agriculture based. We have a tremendous capacity to feed not only Nova Scotians but also people around the world. How can we start to incorporate that into Canada's foreign policy by providing healthy, sustainable food particularly to our allies? If those trading relationships change over time, we should be at the front line of making sure we are providing that, similar to what was done eight decades ago during World War II. We have to be mindful of our defence spending. I asked the member for Durham earlier for his thoughts on mobilization. It is probably early yet for that conversation, but we do need to be mindful of making sure our military, our Canadian Armed Forces, are available and ready. I would agree with my colleagues who talked about the Arctic, whether it be for reasons of climate change, infrastructure, economic opportunities or our sovereignty. That will be an important piece. I wish I had more time. Five minutes is short for a conversation of this gravity and as nuanced as this one is, but I look forward to taking questions from my colleagues.

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Mr. Yves Perron (Berthier—Maskinongé, BQ)

Feb/28/22 8:47:49 p.m.
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Mr. Chair, I thank my colleague for his speech and his sensitivity. We can see he is concerned, as are all of us here in the House. My colleague said that the government is prepared to do more. A number of solutions have been mentioned this evening, including expanding the sanctions to Belarus. I would like to know whether there have been talks with our partners to implement these sanctions as quickly as possible, in order to hurt everyone in the enemy camp. People who have taken Russia's side are no less guilty of these acts of aggression. Also, how can we better target wealthy Russian oligarchs, in an effort to hit the Russian president even harder?

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Mr. Kody Blois

Feb/28/22 8:48:45 p.m.
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Mr. Chair, I thank my colleague for his question. I think it is totally reasonable for our government to consider measures and economic sanctions against Belarus. Belarus is just as guilty, since it helped Russia attack Ukraine. I think this discussion will continue in the House and I agree with the principle of the question.

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Mrs. Tracy Gray (Kelowna—Lake Country, CPC)

Feb/28/22 8:49:34 p.m.
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Mr. Chair, this is an important debate we are having this evening. In the last few days we have seen the spirit of people in my riding of Kelowna—Lake Country stand strong in making their voices heard in support for Ukraine. I want to be clear that Vladimir Putin has created this invasion and human tragedy. It is not the people of Russia. Central Okanagan is home to about 14,000 people of Ukrainian descent, myself included. I have been in touch with the Ukrainian leaders in my community and one of their asks is to immediately implement visas. As the official opposition, as Conservatives, we have actually taken it a step further and have recommended that on travel from Ukraine to Canada we eliminate visas. Would the hon. member be in support of that?

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Mr. Kody Blois

Feb/28/22 8:50:33 p.m.
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Mr. Chair, first of all, one of the points the member raised in her intervention was the fact that there is a separation between the regime in Russia and the Russian people. We have seen that in the demonstrations in cities across Russia. I want to go on record as saying we have to separate the Russian regime from the Russian people. As to her question on immigration, I know our minister, as he mentioned today in the House, is exploring all options. I do not pretend to be privy to the information that he might have in cabinet, but I know that we will be exploring all avenues for Ukrainians who want to come to Canada to be able to get here. Any process to expedite that I certainly support.

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Mr. Richard Cannings (South Okanagan—West Kootenay, NDP)

Feb/28/22 8:51:26 p.m.
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Mr. Chair, we have heard a lot of questions and replies about what Canada can do. We have heard from the Conservatives that we should stop importing Russian oil, which we do not do now anyway. I am wondering what the member would think about having the Canada pension plan divest itself of many very questionable investments many of which relate to Russian oligarchs. That money is used to create war. I am wondering if he could respond to that. My colleague from Cowichan—Malahat—Langford put forward a private member's bill in the last Parliament and it is something that the government should act on.

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Mr. Kody Blois

Feb/28/22 8:52:19 p.m.
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Mr. Chair, the pension board is independent of government, but I think now is the time for government to be looking at all tools available to limit the ability for Russia, for Putin, for the oligarchs to finance the war that we are seeing in Ukraine. If that were something that was available and there were ties, that is something the government could look at, particularly given the circumstances that we are seeing right now.

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Hon. Michael Chong (Wellington—Halton Hills, CPC)

Feb/28/22 8:52:51 p.m.
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Mr. Chair, I will share my time with the member for Charlesbourg—Haute-Saint-Charles. The attack on Ukraine by the Russian Federation, ordered by President Vladimir Putin, is the first European war since the Second World War and a serious violation of international law and our collective humanity. This attack threatens not only Ukraine, but also Canada, because our security has always been inextricably tied to that of Europe. Canadians know well the price we paid in two world wars in Europe. A hundred thousand Canadian war dead can attest to that. This attack, coming on the heels of an autocratic pact between the Russian Federation and the People’s Republic of China, threatens the rules-based international order that has existed since 1945, an order that Canada helped establish. It is an order that has ensured the longest period of relative peace and prosperity in the modern period. It is an order that, if dissolved, threatens Canada’s peace and security here at home. We support the actions taken to date by the Government of Canada, but more needs to be done. The government should expel Russian Ambassador Oleg Stepanov and recall Canadian Ambassador LeClaire from Moscow. It should seek Russia’s removal from multilateral fora such as the G20 and OSCE. Diplomatic isolation is needed because diplomacy did not work. In fact, President Putin used diplomacy for his own purposes to disinform and distract. The government should direct the CRTC to adopt a new policy to terminate licences of state-controlled broadcasters that spread disinformation and propaganda, so that Russia Today, RT, can be removed from Canadian airwaves, as should other authoritarian state-controlled broadcasters operating here in Canada. We must get serious about the disinformation and propaganda spread by proxies of Russia and China here in Canada. The government should also immediately implement visa-free travel for Ukrainians wanting to come to Canada, as member states of the European Union already have done. We must be clear-eyed about these proposed measures. We must be clear-eyed that these proposed measures are not going to stop the invasion in Ukraine. We must be clear-eyed that the measures announced to date by the Government of Canada are not going to stop the invasion in Ukraine. We must be clear-eyed that a middle power like Canada can only do certain things to counter the threat from Vladimir Putin and the Russian Federation. If we are clear-eyed, there are two things we can do. First, we must understand that energy is vital not only to our economy, but also to our security. Russia understands this. Canada has not. Russia supplies 40% of Europe’s natural gas and uses this to intimidate Europe and Ukraine, threatening to cut off supplies. If supplies are cut, people will freeze, factories will shutter and Europe’s economy will plummet. Canada is the fifth-largest natural gas producer in the world, but we cannot get gas to Europe to assist European democracies, because we cannot get pipelines built. Getting natural gas to Atlantic tidewater is vital not only to our economic interest, not only to our environmental interest, but it is also vital to our security interest. We were an arsenal for European democracy decades ago. We can be energy for European democracy today. We must understand that Russia considers the Arctic its most important region. It has spent considerable resources there in recent years. Canada, like Ukraine, shares a border region with Russia, the Arctic Ocean. We no longer can afford to take our security for granted. We need a robust plan to defend Canadian Arctic sovereignty and security that includes purchasing F-35 jets, modernizing NORAD’s early warning system, fixing our national shipbuilding program, joining ballistic missile defence, and closer co-operation with Scandinavian and American allies in the Arctic region. The world has irreversibly changed in the last week. We must get serious about the threats presented by China and Russia. That starts with treating energy as vital not only to our economy, but also to our security, and treating seriously the Arctic as crucial to our sovereignty and to our security.

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Mr. Arif Virani (Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of International Trade, Export Promotion, Small Business and Economic Development, Lib.)

Feb/28/22 8:58:00 p.m.
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Mr. Chair, I know the member for Wellington—Halton Hills is a man who is deeply concerned with foreign policy. What I have remarked upon is the pace at which the international community has moved on this issue, in particular in changing from previously established positions. I am going to point him to the example of Germany. We have seen, in a matter of very short days or weeks, Germany's rejecting the Nord Stream 2 pipeline, Germany's moving to actually fund weapons being delivered by its nation to another foreign nation in Europe, and Germany's backing the elimination or removal of Russia from the SWIFT system of economic exchanges. I want to ask him about his view of the role of Canada in prompting that kind of multilateral co-operation and how we can keep that level of multilateral co-operation with NATO and other allies alive and well, going forward, once we get past this crisis and get Putin out of Ukraine.

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Hon. Michael Chong

Feb/28/22 8:58:56 p.m.
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Mr. Chair, the most important role that Canada can play is to bring members of the NATO alliance more closely together. The single biggest threat that has created gaps between the positions of the various members of the alliance is energy. Russia has used energy as a weapon, as a hard power tool, to cow and intimidate central European democracies, particularly democracies like Italy and Germany, into not taking certain positions in defence of our collective security and our collective defence with the threat of cutting off the 40% of natural gas that Europe uses to heat homes, power industry, produce fertilizer for agriculture and so many other things. If we in this country can understand that energy is essential not only to the economy but also to our security and get pipelines built to Atlantic tidewater, we can help replace Russian gas in western Europe with Canadian natural gas and bring the alliance more closely together. That is one of the two most significant things we can do to strengthen our collective defence and security.

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Ms. Christine Normandin (Saint-Jean, BQ)

Feb/28/22 9:00:16 p.m.
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Mr. Chair, I always enjoy listening to my colleague. I would like to go off on a bit of a tangent, though my question is related to this evening's topic. Many observers of the conflict are pondering whether the international response to the invasion of Ukraine could end up deterring or encouraging China's designs on Taiwan. Should we keep that in mind as we analyze the conflict in Ukraine?

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Hon. Michael Chong

Feb/28/22 9:00:51 p.m.
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Mr. Chair, I think China is watching us and our allies very closely right now to see what we do in response to Russian aggression in eastern Europe. The actions taken by western democracies today are going to dictate the actions of the People's Republic of China for years to come in the Indo-Pacific region. That is why we have to get serious about our foreign policy. We have to get serious about our defence policy, and we have to get serious about our energy policy. If we are clear-eyed about these interests, I think we can defend our values both here and abroad: our belief in freedom, human rights, democracy and the rule of law.

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