Hon. Marc Gold (Government Representative in the Senate): Thank you for the question. It is a serious issue.

The government is aware of the concerns expressed not only by several doctors and doctors’ groups, but also by some provinces and territories that are taking the issue seriously and reflecting on what should be done.

That being said, a report being prepared for February will contain some recommendations on this subject, and the government will take all of this into consideration before making a decision.

[English]

Senator Gold: Thank you for your question.

The C.D. Howe Institute plays an important role. It is one of many think tanks in this country with a range of different ideological stripes.

The fact is that Canada remains an attractive place. It is a stable, democratic country with a healthy economy and an educated workforce, and Canada will continue to be a place where businesses can flourish.

Hon. Leo Housakos: Honourable senators, with leave of the Senate and notwithstanding rule 5-5(a), I move:

That the Standing Senate Committee on Transport and Communications be authorized to meet on Thursday, December 8, 2022, even though the Senate may then be sitting, and that rule 12-18(1) be suspended in relation thereto.

Hon. Leo Housakos: My question is for the Leader of the Government in the Senate.

Yesterday, the Auditor General released a scathing report on the Trudeau government’s spending during the pandemic. She found that over $4 billion was paid to individuals who were ineligible for benefits. She went on to say that payments amounting to $27 billion were suspicious.

In the House of Commons, the Minister of National Revenue suggested the Auditor General was playing political games. She said the Auditor General was pressured by the opposition to produce this report. That is obviously totally false and ridiculous. Shame on her for attacking an officer of Parliament like that.

Senator Gold, why is the government trying to discredit the work of the Auditor General?

Hon. Donald Neil Plett (Leader of the Opposition): Senator Gold, my next question is indeed troubling and very personal. There are now four reported cases of veterans being offered assisted suicide by the federal government, and more cases are expected to come forward.

The Veterans Affairs’ website has the following message front and centre:

If you are a current or former member of the CAF or RCMP, or a family member, we have targeted services and benefits to improve your well-being.

I have pause, as I struggle to stomach this, Senator Gold. The department responsible for providing support and services to members of the Canadian Forces — to soldiers who have put their own lives at risk for us and for others — is offering to our veterans assisted suicide to end their lives, Senator Gold.

Senator Gold: Thank you for the question.

As the Minister of Finance has announced in various speeches surrounding the Fall Economic Statement, the projections of the government are on track for the budget to continue to come down.

The Government of Canada, I repeat, has acted in a prudent and responsible fashion. Indeed, as former Bank of Canada governor David Dodge, in expressing his agreement with how quickly and effectively the Government of Canada responded to the challenges of the pandemic, noted more recently than the beginning of the pandemic, “We’ve never had a recovery as rapid as the one we had in 2021. It was incredible.”

In that regard, Senator Plett, the government will continue to work in the best interests of Canadians, as it was elected to do.

Hon. Marc Gold (Government Representative in the Senate): Thank you for your question, senator.

The government understands, as I’ve said before in this chamber, the importance of investing in research and our students, including graduate students. Indeed, the government has made historical investments in fundamental research over the last five years.

Colleagues, I note that the Advisory Panel on the Federal Research Support System was launched on October 6, 2022, and this panel will provide the Minister of Innovation, Science and Industry and the Minister of Health with policy advice on the structure, the governance and the management of the federal system that supports research and talent. As well, the panel will advise how to ensure that federal support for Canada’s academic research enterprise is coordinated, cohesive, responsive and agile.

The government looks forward to the panel’s work, and it is always looking for ways it can better serve Canadians.

Details of the upcoming budget for this initiative will be made available once it has been tabled.

Senator Dalphond: Yes, of course, with trepidation given that the question is from the bill’s sponsor.

Hon. Senators: Hear, hear.

Senator Martin: Last summer it was the C.D. Howe Institute that issued a report which found that Canada was lagging behind other OECD countries for attracting investment. Researchers wrote:

Business investment is so weak that capital per member of the labour force is falling, and the implications for incomes and competitiveness are ominous.

William B.P. Robson writes:

Investment per available worker lower in Canada than abroad tells us that businesses see less opportunity in Canada, and prefigures weaker growth in Canadian earnings and living standards than in other OECD countries.

Senator Gold, do you agree with all the experts who say that Canada, under Justin Trudeau, is no longer attractive to foreign investors? And what is your government’s plan to correct this?

Senator Dalphond: Bijuralism is a rather Quebec-specific concept. When I was in university, we did not have the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms yet, but we had a lot of discussions about bijuralism and the need to harmonize federal laws with Quebec’s civil law. My professor, André Morel, wrote many articles on the subject.

When the federal harmonization policy was adopted in 1991 or 1993, but before bilingual drafting was introduced, a separate civil law unit was created at the Department of Justice. I believe that happened in 1991. It was a good sign. A deputy minister for civil law was appointed. I believe it was Justice Anne-Marie Trahan. When the bijuralism policy was announced in 1995, it was welcomed in Quebec. I attended many law faculty lectures, and I must confess that I own the three-volume collection published by the Department of Justice on lexicology, history and bijuralism.

Not enough people realize what Canada contributes. As a bijural federation, it is something of a rarity internationally. Our contribution, not only to common law in French and civil law in English, but to bijuralism at the same time, is entirely unique, in my opinion. In that sense, in Quebec and elsewhere in Canada, I think we can be proud. We are participating in two of the world’s great legal traditions, which is also fantastic. I hope that answers your question.

(1530)

[English]

Senator Dalphond: If the Senate agrees.

Senator Kutcher: Thank you very much, Senator Gold. Sadly, we are all aware of the number of panels and reports that have happened before with little action resulting from them. I’m hopeful that it won’t be the same with this one.

But that same report lamented Canada’s inadequate and globally lacking investment in fundamental research; we are way behind. It recommended:

That the Government of Canada review and increase its investments in fundamental research through increases to the budgets of the three granting councils.

Thousands of scientists from across Canada have called for a doubling of the funding for the Tri-Council. Will the Government of Canada heed those calls and provide that essential funding for the upcoming budget, or will we continue to languish behind other countries?

Hon. Donald Neil Plett (Leader of the Opposition): My question to Senator Gold this afternoon is in regard to the unbelievable debt that our government is accumulating on behalf of all taxpayers.

Last month, the Parliamentary Budget Officer, or PBO, released a report containing a risk scenario analysis “to help parliamentarians gauge potential economic and fiscal implications of central banks over-tightening monetary policy.” Under the PBO’s risk scenario analysis, they estimated that public debt charges could reach $53.4 billion in 2024-25. That, Senator Gold, would be an increase of 118% over the debt charges of 2021-22. To put that number in perspective, debt charges basically equal, in two years, what we will spend on our entire defence and on services to Indigenous and northern communities.

Senator Gold, what is your government’s long-term plan to pay the interest costs for this pile of Justin Trudeau-Jagmeet Singh debt? Will you cut services to vulnerable Canadians? Will you raise taxes? Or will you continue with the spiral of unending deficits?

Senator Housakos: Senator Gold, the Auditor General said that it was not effective at all. She found $27 billion in suspicious payments.

Like many of her colleagues, Minister Diane Lebouthillier is making blunder after blunder and, like her colleagues, she never apologizes. Your government is always ready to apologize for mistakes made by others years ago, but it is never ready to take responsibility for its own.

When will the minister apologize to the Auditor General of Canada?

Senator Plett: I’m surprised how you take solace in the fact that it is not all your fault. Maybe it isn’t all your fault, but certainly a good percentage of it is your fault, and when I say “you,” I mean the Liberal-NDP government. The whole economic plan of the Trudeau-Freeland team was to fuel Canada’s growth with cheap debt. The budget, Senator Gold, again, was to balance itself.

Government leader, the party is now over. The Bank of Canada raised interest rates today for the seventh time this year. Sadly, it will be future generations — your grandchildren, my grandchildren and our great-grandchildren — who will suffer the consequences of your government’s failed economic policies — your government.

Senator Gold, when is the federal budget going to balance itself?

Hon. Marc Gold (Government Representative in the Senate): Thank you for the question.

The government takes seriously any allegation of foreign interference in our system.

The government relies on a rigorous screening system for all partners and all initiatives, including procurement processes. I’m told the government is aware of the allegations regarding the contract that you just mentioned with Sinclair Technologies. As the Prime Minister said, the government looked into the allegations, and it will take all the necessary measures to ensure the integrity of our critical infrastructure.

I’m also told that Minister Mendicino has instructed his senior officials to review the details of that contract carefully in order to reassess the process under which it was awarded.

Senator Gold: However, it is not my understanding that the services to which you refer on the website include medical assistance in dying. I’m assured that providing advice pertaining to medical assistance in dying is absolutely not a Veterans Affairs Canada service. You didn’t say it in so many words, Senator Plett, but you implied it, so I’m glad for the opportunity to correct the record.

Colleagues, this is a serious matter. I’d like to finish my answer. I understand the minister has directed the department to conduct a full investigation, which is ongoing, to ensure that all front-line staff are trained to deal with any issues, including issues around medical assistance in dying, or MAID, and to ensure that this never happens again. The government is taking all necessary steps to make sure that no veteran ever has to go through this again.

Senator Plett: Let me repeat what Senator Batters alluded to: Who is going to get fired, Senator Gold? Something happened here. Somebody dropped the ball, Senator Gold. You can say all you want that this will never happen again. But it is happening — over, and over, and over again. The lives of our veterans mean nothing to this government. They have put their lives on the line for you and me, Senator Gold. How can this even happen, Senator Gold, not once or twice, but on four occasions — four times — with more cases expected to come forward.

Minister MacAulay’s mandate letter said the following:

Your top priority is to ensure that services and benefits necessary for the physical, mental and economic wellbeing of Veterans and their families are easily accessible, responsive, and available in a timely manner.

Obviously, this is rhetoric. These are only words. The reality — let me finish — is quite different, Senator Gold. Under the Trudeau government, we have seen wait times increased, veterans brought to court and now assisted suicide offered to our courageous veterans.

Senator Gold, shuffling ministers out of this portfolio has not been successful for your government. At what point will our veterans get the respect and the services that they need and died for?

An Hon. Senator: Let him finish!