Hon. Victor Oh: Honourable senators, I rise today to pay tribute to a great friend, mentor and extraordinary Canadian, Hazel McCallion, who sadly passed on Sunday, two and a half weeks shy of her one hundred and second birthday. A long-time mayor of Mississauga, Hazel McCallion led a small collective of towns in the late 1970s to transform into the sixth-largest city in Canada. Most importantly, Hazel was instrumental in turning Mississauga into one of the most culturally diverse cities in the country.

Personally, Hazel applied the same work ethic and enthusiasm to her friendships. Ours, for example, spanned over three decades, with many trips abroad, monthly breakfasts and countless cherished memories. As I was a new Canadian, she took me under her wing and guided me on the ways of Canada, in particular, our respect and appreciation for diversity and a strong commitment to community service. I’m certain that if not for her friendship and guidance, I would never have the opportunity to sit in this chamber at the service of Ontarians and Canadians.

I last saw Hazel two weeks ago. We chatted, debated and reminisced in our familiar patterns. Before my departure, the forever-playful Hazel left me with a very special parting gift, one of her famous bobble-head dolls, which she dated and signed. Needless to say, this will be a cherished piece of memorabilia in the Oh household.

Colleagues, I consider myself extremely fortunate to have had over 30 years of friendship with Hazel McCallion. She will be terribly missed by me and my family. I would like to wish her children, Peter, Paul and Linda, my sincere condolences. Hazel, thank you for your service to Canada. May she rest in peace, thank you.

The Hon. the Speaker: Is it your pleasure, honourable senators, to adopt the motion?

Some Hon. Senators: Yes.

The Hon. the Speaker: All those in favour of the motion will please say “yea.”

The Hon. the Speaker: Senator Richards, are you asking for five more minutes?

(1550)

Senator Cormier: I have a supplementary question for Senator Richards.

Senator Richards, like me, you sat on the committee and you heard the multitude of artists and artistic organizations that came to talk to us and who weren’t afraid to express how they felt about the freedom of expression that Bill C-11 prevents them from having.

Explain to me why you have such a concern when the entire Canadian ecosystem at the professional artist level doesn’t seem to have this concern. Are they simply misguided?

[English]

The Hon. the Speaker: Senator Housakos, he has three-and-a-half minutes.

Senator Bellemare: Okay, the activities. That is the activity we completed, and we will continue. Thank you.

The Hon. the Speaker pro tempore: Senator Housakos, you have the floor.

[English]

Senator Richards: They should be, senator. I’ll tell you a story about this young Mi’kmaq girl that I helped in the university. The story has never been published. She was a little girl who was asked by her mother not to play in the woods because there had been a murder there. I won’t tell you what reserve it is. She went down to the water and her mother said, “You cannot play in the water because a man drowned a woman there.” She went on the street and her mother said, “You can’t go on the street because there are too many people and too much danger.” She could only find one place to sit. This was a seven-page story, and I had tears in my eyes when I read it because it reminded me of my own granddaughter. The only place she could sit was in the basement of her house in her bedroom, and it was there where her uncle had hung himself.

That story, written by a girl from a reserve near us, was absolutely moving, but it had nothing to do with identity politics. It had to do with identifying one human heart to the other. That is what I’m afraid this CRTC bill loses in the context of the bill. That’s the reason. Thank you.

Hon. Colin Deacon: Senator Manning, one of the concerns I have with our regulatory burden in Canada — there is so much that has been embedded in legislation that, absolutely, we know how slowly we get new legislation through this chamber.

When you embed something like that into legislation, like a certain threshold — whether or not this is needed or required in any way; I can’t speak to that — but, certainly, I’m trying to move away from that.

Have you considered options as it relates to having this threshold that you think is so important given as advice to government in regulations? The reality is, if we put a specific number into the legislation, that’s almost impossible to change. This is 30 years in the making — this change that we are seeing right now. Is that something you have considered? Is that something you have worked on and considered — any alternatives other than embedding in legislation?

Senator Housakos: Senator Richards, we have heard time and again — and we heard it again from the sponsor of the bill today — how Canada needs to protect Canadian culture. Again, I’ve said this many times, I think Canadian culture has never been as strong as it is today. Our writers, producers, actors, singers — we’ve seen what modern-day platforms have done for people like The Weeknd, Justin Bieber and so many others.

Can you tell us what, if anything, is out there that requires legislation in the Parliament of Canada and the Government of Canada that needs to protect Canadian culture in 2023?

Senator Richards: Thank you for the question. I don’t think very much can be in their hands because it reminds me of the story about a Czechoslovakian clown in Prague who did this little act and he was brilliant at it. He had a little cowboy hat, a lasso and he could slip through the lasso — he was an absolute magician. The state artistic community stopped him from doing that because it showed Western culture decadence. That is the kind of thing that, although extremely subtle in this bill — and I say is extremely subtle — still is an overplay toward Canadian culture that will undermine it, and that is why I spoke today on it.

There is no reason in the world why we need to do that.

[Translation]

Senator Richards: Again, I come back to what I said before — that sooner or later talent will rise to the top. That’s all I’m saying.

Maybe I’m from “old Canada,” but I didn’t have a reading outside of New Brunswick until I wrote my fifth book. I didn’t get reviews that complimented my work until I was published in New York. So “old Canada” as it is, I struggled through all of that and I’m not one bit ashamed of it. I think a hundred other artists and poets and writers have done the same thing. We all reach our level in different ways. If the person you are talking about has reached her level in that way, that’s fine. But I don’t think the CRTC is a platform that will automatically ensure greatness of expression. As a matter of fact, I think it will probably do damage to greatness of expression.

[Translation]

Senator Miville-Dechêne: I rise to speak at third reading of Bill C-11, An Act to amend the Broadcasting Act.

Many things have been said about this bill over the months — before, during and after the review in committee. To some, Bill C-11 is absolutely necessary and should have been passed without amendment several months ago. To others, this is machiavellian legislation that jeopardizes the rights and freedoms of Canadians. I’d like to state from the outset what this bill does and what it doesn’t do.

[English]

First, the bill does not censor or restrict Canadians’ freedom of expression in any way. Once the bill is passed, all Canadian residents will continue to publish and consume all the cultural content they want, just as before. Whatever is available today will continue to be there. Anything you want to publish today can be published tomorrow. As such, nothing changes. With all due respect, those who denounce Bill C-11 as an evil act of censorship and infringement on our rights and freedoms are out to lunch.

What Bill C-11 does seek to do, however, is offer some support to our creators and, in particular, to Canadian creators in a minority situation. This support takes two forms: money and increased visibility. Under the bill, the major streaming platforms will have to contribute financially to Canadian culture and they will have to promote and recommend the works of our creators.

[Translation]

This bill is especially important to me as a Quebecer and particularly as a francophone because French is a minority language in a cultural ecosystem where discovery occurs first and foremost on foreign platforms where English is the dominant language.

Let’s be clear. Bill C-11 won’t provide a miracle solution. However, this bill with its rather imperfect regulatory tools constitutes a first step toward giving our creators a chance to make a name for themselves in the flood of global content.

Many unknowns remain, even after a lengthy study in committee. What specific criteria will determine what constitutes Canadian content? How will the visibility of Canadian content be measured? How can we promote Canadian content without making undue changes to the user experience? What does the word “discoverability” even mean? It is rather central to this bill, but it has yet to be defined. It will be up to the CRTC to answer these complex questions, which some people say will just open a can of worms.

Since Bill C-11 was introduced, some critics have found that the discoverability measures in particular constitute an inexcusable violation of consumer preferences and platform algorithms. I don’t see it that way. The market is not a god, and even in the internet age, it is still appropriate for countries to support their culture and defend their cultural sovereignty.

Despite the limitations of Bill C-11, I believe it is essential that Canada deploy legislative and regulatory tools to support its film, music and digital works in the context of globalization. Historically, Canada has taken the necessary steps to ensure that its cultures — particularly its minority cultures — have a voice, exist and are known and appreciated. Of course, with the evolution of technological platforms, it makes sense that our means of intervention should adapt, but the political and cultural imperative remains. Canadian culture, particularly minority and francophone culture, is not a commodity like any other.

I note, however, that Bill C-11 has shone a light on a generational conflict that we must consider. In Quebec in particular, nostalgic people praise the 65% francophone music quota on Quebec radio, which certainly allowed several generations, like mine, to get to know Quebec classics such as Robert Charlebois, Beau Dommage and Harmonium. However, younger people don’t listen to much radio or watch much TV anymore. They are on Spotify or YouTube and they value that freedom, which has increased their listening possibilities tenfold and opened new markets. These are real benefits that no one, even older people, would want to do without now.

The trade-off, however, is that young Quebecers no longer know their local artists, they listen to them less and less, so I’m worried about the sustainability of my culture.

This is a sensitive but crucial issue. We have to strike a balance between wanting to expose users to new Canadian cultural content while protecting their freedom and media consumption experience. I admit that is a major challenge.

In terms of legislation, the internet is still a new subject area that raises a number of issues. Bill C-11 is a first attempt at legislating in favour of Canadian culture, but it is certainly not the end of the line. There are bound to be mistakes and adjustments that have to be made as platforms evolve. This bill actually gives the CRTC a lot of flexibility.

As the committee wrapped up its study, some were still questioning the validity of Bill C-11, but what’s the alternative? I think the status quo isn’t viable for our creators, especially francophone creators. It is magical thinking to believe that market forces will miraculously enable Canada’s francophone creators to survive and have an impact despite being a drop in the ocean. Right now, that francophone content is being drowned out.

When singer David Bussières appeared before the committee, he neatly summed up the situation as follows:

 . . . the longer it takes, the greater the hegemonic effect of the Big Tech oligopoly in distancing audiences from local content. Our cultural identity is ultimately at stake, with all its diversity . . . and the fact that it is home to the only francophone communities in America.

During the study in committee, the senators from the Independent Senators Group, of which I am a member, got the 18 amendments that they moved adopted. Some of those were major amendments.

In my opinion, the most important amendment, which was prepared in cooperation with Senator Paula Simons, strikes to the heart of the debates on Bill C-11, namely, the scope of the exception for content generated by social media users.

The adopted amendment curbs the CRTC’s discretionary power and basically limits the bill’s application to professional music content. This further guarantees that YouTubers will not be targeted by Bill C-11, even if they generate revenue. This amendment also recognizes the fact that the world of cultural creation has changed. Individual creators have flooded social media with special content. They aren’t subsidized. They don’t have money. They manage on their own and they use their own business model. Our amendment helps to better maintain their autonomy.

I personally moved two other amendments, which were adopted. The first was in keeping with the recommendation of the Privacy Commissioner, Philippe Dufresne, who was of the opinion that Bill C-11 should better respect consumers’ and creators’ right to privacy. That is a significant addition given the considerable exchange of personal information resulting from the regulations.

The other amendment is the result of my long-standing commitment to protecting children from exposure to online pornography — or what is called adult content, which is regularly consumed by millions of children around the world — which causes obvious harm. The objective of Bill C-11 is to give the CRTC the power to regulate online platforms in the same way that it can regulate traditional broadcasters. The CRTC already has the ability to regulate access to sexually explicit content in traditional broadcasting, through cable or satellite, and my amendment only transfers that ability to online content.

The amendment reads as follows:

 . . . online undertakings shall implement methods, such as age-verification methods, to prevent children from accessing programs on the Internet that are devoted to depicting, for a sexual purpose, explicit sexual activity;

This is simply a statement of principle. The regulations and consultations should be carried out before these age verifications go into effect. The objective is simple. We will apply to the internet precautions that exist in the physical world to protect children from adult content.

[English]

I will conclude with a few words about algorithms, which were discussed at length during our committee hearings. These algorithms are, in a way, the secret sauce that determines what content is recommended and put forward for a given user. I say “secret sauce,” because we know almost nothing about these formulas which are closely guarded by the platforms. These algorithms incorporate several variables and data with the goal of attracting and retaining users for as long as possible. Yet, for some, these algorithms are not only confidential but sacrosanct — any attempt to intervene in favour of Canadian content thus constitutes a form of crime against the free market.

Here is what Brock University Professor Blayne Haggart told the committee about algorithms:

Algorithms become one of those magic and scary words that intimidate people, but all they really are is a set of rules that are repeated over and over again. . . . It is a form of regulation.

These privatized discoverability regulations are not designed simply to surface the most popular content or the content that you, the viewer, or reader, are most interested in. These companies do not just tell us what content is popular; they define what popular means. They already create winners and losers and they define popular to fit their own interests, however they decide to define them.

Personally, between private and opaque discoverability rules and public and transparent discoverability norms, I prefer the latter. That being said, I have no doubt that the platforms will adapt intelligently to the new requirements, and that they will continue to offer their Canadian users the content they like and are looking for, in addition to showcasing our creators.

Of course, this is not about censoring anything, or limiting access or distribution of any content. And it’s certainly not about destroying the engaging, modern platforms that we all use every day. It is about updating our means to implement our essential cultural policy. I simply do not see why a country like Canada should accept that private, foreign platforms be the only ones to decide what priority to give to Canadian, Quebec and Indigenous culture.

Adapting our policies and laws to the evolution of technology is not easy. Acting always involves risks. It is always easier to wait or to do nothing. But in this case, as in others, I believe that inaction would be fatal, and that boldness is necessary.

[Translation]

In conclusion, I will resolutely vote in favour of Bill C-11. Thank you.

[English]

Senator Housakos: Will Senator Miville-Dechêne take a question, please?

Senator Miville-Dechêne said that algorithms, in essence, equate to regulation, and it is the furthest thing from the truth. Algorithms, as they’re being used by platforms, are a form of computation. What algorithms do is they follow our habits, and they push up — on their algorithm system — what we want to see.

Regulation is quite the contrary. Regulation is where a group of gatekeepers — a word that is popular these days — be it the CRTC or government legislators, will determine what should be prioritized. That’s very different — algorithm compared to regulation.

[Translation]

Senator Miville-Dechêne: I completely disagree with you.

Neither you nor I have the formula for the algorithms on the platforms. You say that it’s the most popular content that’s promoted. Frankly, senator, we know nothing about that. For example, is there an agreement with an advertising company that would ask to promote a certain singer or a certain product? We don’t know.

You don’t know the algorithms. I don’t know them either. It is a private company that decides what is going to be promoted. In our culture, in our cultural policies, we have thus far given subsidies to Canadian companies. We have asked broadcasters to broadcast Canadian culture. This isn’t about censorship here, as I’ve mentioned several times. These private companies simply need to leave some room for our Canadian culture. The algorithms certainly don’t provide this freedom that you talk about, which allows only the best to be promoted.

[English]

Hon. Marty Klyne: Good for you.

Hon. Mary Coyle: Honourable senators, I rise to pay tribute to my friend and colleague Dr. Jody Kretzmann, who sadly passed away on January 1.

Best known for his work with the Asset-Based Community Development Institute, or ABCD, originally at Northwestern University and now at DePaul, and for his groundbreaking book Building Communities From the Inside Out, co-authored with John McKnight, Jody Kretzmann helped revolutionize community work from a dependency-creating and often demeaning approach that only sees problems and needs to one that instead recognizes local strengths, assets and valued experiences with local people mobilizing their own assets and building on those. Jody wrote a Harvard Law School reference for Barack Obama, whom he knew from their days of community organizing in Chicago.

At his funeral, attended by people from all over the world, Jody was described as an athlete, organizer, thinker, teacher, a welcoming friend who was a good listener, and a joyful, optimistic man who was nurturing and known for his kindness.

Jody Kretzmann made a huge impact in inner-city Chicago, and his ABCD work inspired tidal waves of impact around the world — several through Coady Institute partnerships. Karri‑Lynn Paul, an Indigenous leader with Coady’s Circle of Abundance, Indigenous Programs, said:

I am excited about using ABCD as a decolonizing method in changing how Indigenous and non-Indigenous people think about and see Indigenous communities. It provides a solid foundation on which to build on the abundance that already exists in Indigenous communities.

Lucía DiPoi, Executive Director of CLE, the Haitian Centre for Leadership and Excellence, said:

In Haiti — with decades of failed, internationally led development — the ABCD approach goes in the opposite direction — working with communities to shine a light on their resources, expertise, talents, priorities and essentially their rights and capacities to determine their own destiny. ABCD has resonated so well in Haiti because of the clear contrast with the old paradigm which only highlights everything Haiti isn’t and everything it lacks.

As I conclude this tribute to Jody, I quote advice from the man himself:

Look for capacities in unexpected places. Be surprised. Welcome everyone. Invite them in. Move slowly and quietly. Be open to what’s there and don’t be looking for something that isn’t there. . . . Toss the ball to others and assume they have the gifts to run with it. . . . Respect everyone . . . .

Jody Kretzmann, I raise, in your honour and with great affection, this glass, half-full, just exactly the way you always saw the world. Wela’lioq, thank you.

Hon. Paula Simons: Honourable senators, on Friday, Edmonton’s journalism community came together to mourn one of their own: Janice Johnston, who covered cops and courts for the CBC. She was a reporter’s reporter, the kind of tough and tender woman who put the broad in broadcaster.

For more than 30 years, Johnston covered some of the biggest crime stories in the country without fear or favour. She went toe to toe with the police, never hesitating to call them to account. At one point, they actually, outrageously, got a warrant to tap her private phone because they were so frustrated that she would not give up her sources. She was just as hard on judges — fighting publication bans because she believed the public had a right to know what went on in public courtrooms.

Along the way, she earned the respect of homicide detectives and Crown prosecutors, defence attorneys and judges, for her precise professionalism and ferocious work ethic.

One of the most important stories of her long career involved an Indigenous woman who had been the victim of a brutal, near-lethal sexual assault. The Crown prosecutor, worried the woman might not show up to testify, had her jailed. The woman was transported to and from court in shackles, right next to the man accused of raping her. Like an avenging angel, Janice worked to expose what had happened.

With passion and heart, she covered murders and child abuse trials, police misconduct hearings and disbarment proceedings. She was a ferocious competitor and loved nothing better than getting the scoop. Very, very occasionally, I would beat her to a story. Watching her fury filled me with glee, because to beat Janice was a victory indeed. It was even more fun when we worked in tandem to fight a publication ban or unseal an exhibit because, while she was a great competitor, she was also a hilarious and inspiring comrade-in-arms.

At her memorial service, her husband Scott, a veteran city hall correspondent, talked about what it was like to live in a house where, he joked, he was always the second-best reporter. Just once in their 36-year marriage he beat her to a story about the resignation of a police chief. She called him moments after his scoop went to air, with words he could not repeat in a United Church.

Earlier, in the 1990s, she worked for CFRN, Edmonton’s CTV affiliate. But when she turned 39, the station’s new managers slowly pulled her off air, replacing her with younger faces. She quit in protest and announced that she was leaving journalism. But she couldn’t be kept away. After a few years as a media consultant, she returned to the fray at CBC, where she did some of her best and most important work — long after her hair went silver.

She’ll be so missed by Scott, their daughter Samantha and their granddaughter Cali, and missed by every Edmontonian who turned to Janice Johnston for truth in our city’s darkest moments.

Thank you, hiy hiy.

[Translation]