SoVote

Context: House Hansard - 290 - Mar/18/24

Mar/18/24 5:42:50 p.m.
Watch

Mr. Speaker, lasting peace in the region is really very important, and we have to make sure that we put an end to the killing of innocent civilians. We have lost over 31,000 innocent civilians through this war. Voting in favour or against this motion is about morals; it is about humanity. I will be voting in favour, because I think it is the right thing to do. There should be an immediate ceasefire, and there should be unimpeded access for humanitarian aid in the region.

87 words

Ms. Lindsay Mathyssen (London—Fanshawe, NDP)

Mar/18/24 5:43:38 p.m.
Watch

Mr. Speaker, I will be splitting my time with the hon. member for Windsor West. There are many reasons I am proud to be a New Democrat. New Democrats work to make government responsive to the needs of Canadians; we are building the social programs that create fairness, equality and social democracy; we build people up; we celebrate not only what makes us different but also what brings us together; and we know that only by working together, neighbour to neighbour, shoulder to shoulder, are we stronger. Unlike other parties that only work to secure their own power or work to tear people down and pit them against each other, we know that government is for people and by people, and New Democrats fight for that for everyone, everywhere. We truly understand the importance of human rights. We know that justice or fairness cannot be a slogan; it cannot be used to manipulate people into voting for one party. It is not something that only applies to a certain group of people, and it certainly does not just apply to those with the deepest pockets or those who expect power and wield it in a self-serving manner. As New Democrats, we are used to doing the right thing before everyone else does. We are the party that knows the value of medicare, pharmacare and a pension plan. We are the party with leaders such as Alexa McDonough, who stood with Maher Arar without question, and Ed Broadbent, whose human rights advocacy was celebrated globally. The fight for equality and human rights is why New Democrats have brought forward today's motion, which I am proud to support. Many people know that, two months ago, I visited East Jerusalem and the West Bank. I went because of my constituents. In London, we are so lucky to have one of the largest communities of Palestinian Canadians, but I see the pain in their eyes and I hear the desperation in their voices when they ask me to help get their families out of Gaza. My constituents have repeatedly told me that Gaza is but one part of occupied Palestine in which the human rights of Palestinians are denied. In the West Bank and East Jerusalem, the insecurity and the targeting of Palestinians by settlers and Israeli forces have only increased in recent months. This is a serious crisis of global proportions that has deeply affected members of my riding in London, and I had to go see it for myself. I can honestly say that the trip was one of the hardest things I have done, but it was also one of the most important. I visited refugee camps with families who had lived there for generations; families who still hope for a day when they can be reunited with their loved ones, returning to their former homes on their land; and families who live in villages where every single building is riddled with bullet holes, where the infrastructure and the people are attacked daily. I have never experienced such systematic dehumanization. I have never seen what many human rights groups call a system of apartheid. I saw injustice, despair, poverty and generational trauma. I also saw children playing with such innocence and joy, and I will never forget their beautiful faces. I was greeted by people who were so generous with what little they had. They invited me into their homes with incredible kindness. However, they carry unimaginable trauma. They have seen an incredible amount of violence. The reality of living in a refugee camp, where death and destruction permeate everything they know, is untenable. I spoke to young people at the UNRWA school in Amman, who asked their teachers why they were being taught about human rights when they would never know them. I must never forget what I witnessed, and I will never stop fighting for their future and for their human rights. The past five months have been incredibly painful for many in my community. As members of our communities mourn friends and family in Israel who were killed in the Hamas attacks, many are also watching Netanyahu’s collective punishment of the people of Gaza in horror. In London, I meet with many people who live in fear every day that they may never see their sons, their parents, their brothers or their cousins again. Muslims in London, in Canada and around the world are observing Ramadan and, despite the heaviness in our hearts, I want to wish them Ramadan Mubarak. I have broken the fast with many in my community over the years, but this year is very different. Instead of a joyful coming together at Iftars, last week, I spoke with so many who are angry, scared, frustrated and devastated by the lack of action and courage from the Canadian government. My riding and my city are still scarred from the heinous murder of a beautiful Muslim family. My city is still dealing with the aftermath of this terrorist attack on a member of our own. Our London family stays in our hearts, and after that attack in 2021, I watched tens of thousands of Londoners come together and promise that we would remain united and fight for each other. However, this will leave a scar on my community for many generations. Now, on top of all that pain, my constituents watch what the International Court of Justice says is a plausible genocide in Gaza, and the Liberal government does nothing. My office helped a grandmother escape from Gaza a few months ago. She cannot celebrate the safety she now has with her family. Instead, she constantly watches the television and the news in fear, desperately hoping for a ceasefire. She is terrified for the children, grandchildren, family and friends she has left behind. She finds no solace in Canada. Many others on both sides of this war also find no comfort living in Canada or being Canadian. They have told me they feel like second-class citizens here. They are treated differently. They are discriminated against. They see anti-Semitism, Islamophobia and anti-Palestinian hatred grow. They see their government, which once had a reputation in the world as a leader against that kind of racism and violence, now hide away from taking real action or being a leader in the world. They have also told me that some of what the government has done is actually more harmful to them. In December, as Canadians appealed to the government to help their loved ones reach safety, New Democrats asked for the introduction of special immigration measures for Gaza. While the government did finally announce some measures, the actual rollout included a discriminatory and arbitrary cap of 1,000 applications, as well as demeaning questions. To date, not one applicant has arrived. My constituents told me directly that these actions by the Government of Canada were racist and made them question whether they were truly seen as citizens. In the House today, we have the opportunity to take a stand against that hatred. We cannot turn our backs on people, using the excuse that the situation is simply too complicated. It is actually very simple: We must uphold international law. Canada can and must do what New Democrats have outlined in our motion. We have to reinstate the UNRWA funding and protect against the suspension ever happening again. Canada must respect the ruling from the International Court of Justice and support the court’s work. We have to ban extremist settlers and impose sanctions on Israeli officials who incite genocide, just as we have imposed sanctions on Hamas leaders. We have to stop fuelling this crisis with weapons and abide by the UN's and the International Court of Justice's calls to stop all arms exports to Israel, as they are concerned about the violation of international humanitarian law. We need to work with international partners to counter terrorism in the Middle East. We need to officially recognize the state of Palestine and work toward a two-state solution. We need to do the hard work diplomatically to help end the decades-long occupation of Palestinian territories and invest in building a just and sustainable peace for Palestinians and Israelis. We need to stand up for human rights and the dignity of all Canadians, for my constituents in London, for the people I visited in the Jenin and Jerash refugee camps and for the millions of people in Gaza who are not responsible for the actions of Hamas, but who deserve to live. As the NDP’s critic for national defence, I need to take a few more moments to speak to growing concerns about our role in this conflict. Through operations Artemis, Impact and Proteus and our participation in Operation Prosperity Guardian, Canadian Armed Forces members had been deployed in the region long before this conflict began. I have tried to get a briefing for the Standing Committee on National Defence on their role, but I was told officials were unavailable. I requested a briefing from the minister and have received no response. It is unacceptable that the government refuses to provide clear explanations and transparency with the public around our military roles in the region. As parliamentarians, we have a sacred obligation to every person in uniform to ensure that, when we are asking them to risk their lives abroad, we are doing so to serve Canada’s highest values. We need to have transparency in this. We cannot repeat the same grave mistakes we made in Somalia or Afghanistan. As parliamentarians, we have a lot of tough decisions to make, but I am determined to make a real difference and improve the lives of my constituents. Today we discuss Canada’s responsibility to its citizens, its place in the world and its reputation for doing the right thing. I implore all members. They have the choice and the chance to vote for this motion, which is something that could put us on the right side of history, and to say to those children I met in the West Bank and Jordan and those tens of thousands of children now at risk of starvation and death in Gaza that they are worth protecting. They can have a peaceful future if we build it together.

1728 words

Mr. Chandra Arya (Nepean, Lib.)

Mar/18/24 5:53:44 p.m.
Watch

Mr. Speaker, like her, a few years back, I visited Palestine and the West Bank, and, like her, I noted the worsening conditions of the occupiers imposed on Palestinian people. I note she mentioned the human rights report, the Amnesty International report, which was also concurred in by the Israeli human rights commission on the apartheid policies that Israel imposes on the occupied territories. During her visit, did she see the settlers violence? Unfortunately, people know about the violence that is happening in Gaza with over 30,000 people killed, but not many people are aware of the settlers violence happening in the West Bank. I will ask her to briefly speak on that.

114 words

Ms. Lindsay Mathyssen

Mar/18/24 5:54:41 p.m.
Watch

Mr. Speaker, when we had a chance to visit the Jenin Camp in the West Bank, we saw that violence. It occurs every day. In fact, every night, settlers will come into the camp to destroy all the infrastructure: the water storage units and the roads. They even go so far as the destruction of garbage cans so that they cannot collect garbage, and it piles up. They attempt to do everything possible to drive people out. It was incredible to see, like I said in my speech, the children who run around that camp. As soon as they know that a stranger is safe, as strangers are not always safe because of the nightly and daily violence they see, they run over to them and want to practice their English. They want to hug them. There is a chance we have here to save that innocence and to save those children, and I ask the House do that today.

160 words

Mr. Brad Redekopp (Saskatoon West, CPC)

Mar/18/24 5:55:53 p.m.
Watch

Mr. Speaker, when we saw what happened in Israel following the heinous attacks by Hamas on October 7, and when we see what is happening to innocent civilians in Gaza who are also victims of Hamas's violent ideology, our hearts go out to all the innocent people who are suffering, especially because many of those suffering are women and children. Conservatives want peace in the region, and we believe that, ultimately, this would be achieved through a two-state solution, negotiated and agreed upon by both sides. However, we also know this can only happen once Hamas and other terrorist organizations are removed from power. We know this can only happen when Israelis and Palestinians can be guaranteed peace and security, living side by side. This has been the policy of Canada for decades, under both Liberal and Conservative governments, yet it is the policy that this motion seeks to upend. Will the member admit that by abandoning this policy, this motion would do nothing to bring peace and security to Israelis and Palestinians?

175 words

Ms. Lindsay Mathyssen

Mar/18/24 5:56:50 p.m.
Watch

Mr. Speaker, I am sorry the hon. member does not understand what the motion actually calls for. It calls for the ceasefire. It calls for that peace. It calls for the recognition of two states in order to create a two-state solution. It does not recognize anything beyond what Hamas has done, and we certainly call that out in terms of the violence that has been created. Ultimately, violence has to stop before conversations can begin, and that has taken a long time. That may continue to take a long time. We have to take a stand, and we have to show the courage to do so. I ask the hon. member to take a serious consideration of what that courage looks like.

124 words

Mr. Luc Desilets (Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, BQ)

Mar/18/24 5:57:31 p.m.
Watch

Mr. Speaker, I would like to know what my colleague from London—Fanshawe thinks about the Liberals' position. At the beginning of the day, it was my understanding that they did not support this motion. Now, we have just heard a few speeches that suggest that the Liberals might vote in favour of the motion. Perhaps it will be a free vote. What does she think? Are they for or against the motion? If they are against it, what aspect of the motion do they not like? The Bloc Québécois thinks that this motion is perfectly acceptable.

102 words

Ms. Lindsay Mathyssen

Mar/18/24 5:58:10 p.m.
Watch

Mr. Speaker, I think those are really great questions for the Liberals within caucus. I certainly have seen some come forward to openly support this and some of those who do not. I am frustrated by the fact that the government seems to want to be able to take two sides on this, when calling for a ceasefire is what I truly believe is necessary, and coming forward. Again, I call for courage within the House. I advocate for all members in the House to do so. I know that, within my community, the frustration with Liberals trying to hold both sides will not continue to hold water.

108 words

Mr. Brian Masse (Windsor West, NDP)

Mar/18/24 5:59:18 p.m.
Watch

Mr. Speaker, I appreciate the opportunity to rise in this chamber on this very serious issue. I am proud to have a party that is not afraid and that would not run away from the difficult discussions that have to happen on the fact that this country can play a role of positive influence. Like many people, on October 7, we were horrified to see what Hamas had done. The continued killing of hostages is something we can never recover from in any respect, whatsoever, for the people of Israel, who are continuing to suffer from the loss. We know there has been a political movement, even in Israel itself, to free the hostages as a primary element. I can say that, as horrifying as that day was, further killing is not going to bring back the victims. One really important thing to keep in mind in this debate is that in the past, Canada has made, and can make, a difference. This is a discussion that is happening in many chambers across the world, including the United States most recently, where Senator Chuck Schumer intervened on the issue of Netanyahu, calling him a “major obstacle to peace”. Therefore, it is important to recognize the responsible motion that we have put forward here, calling for several objectives that could make a difference for the victims. I am thinking of my area in Windsor-Detroit where, outside of the Middle East, we have the largest Muslim population and many Palestinians and others. I am thinking of my friend Rashida Tlaib. Every time we have touched base on this issue and on other things, it has always ended with “save lives”. I had a chance to visit with her in Washington, D.C., this past week, and I can tell members again that the message right now is how we can continue to save lives. What Canada needs to do right now is to put further pressure to see this happen. I have been in this chamber and have seen what can take place when Canada goes to the roots of its democracy in this chamber and how it can make a difference. I had a motion on the genocide in Srebrenica that was passed in this chamber. It was done with the Conservatives at that time. Lawrence Cannon, the minister of transport at the time, also took an interest in this. We passed a motion that recognized Srebrenica as a genocide. The reason I raise this as an important factor is that I went to Bosnia and later to Sarajevo. In Sarajevo there is the monument that recognizes the children who were murdered. It has two pillars on the inside and also has an area that goes around it with the footprints of children to recognize their lives that were lost. I went to the Srebrenica–Potočari Memorial. Right now, it recognizes 8,372 victims who have been identified, and each year, 25 years later, there are still more bodies being found and identified because there are 7,000 or more missing. At that time, there were 8,000 Muslim boys, men and youth murdered and massacred in eight days. The world did not act enough at that time, so now it has been called the biggest forensic puzzle in the world. I remember going there after we passed our motion. It is actually recognized in the Canadian Museum for Human Rights. I felt ashamed, basically, that all we could offer at that time was recognition of their suffering as they continued to grieve. I will never forget meeting with the mothers of the genocide victims down at the site. I will never forget when one of them grabbed my arm and thanked me. Meanwhile, that day, she was burying her son and her husband, and all that was left of them were pieces of their arms and shoulders. That is all there was to identify them. She thanked me and presented me with the flower of Srebrenica, which has 11 petals in recognition of that day in July. What happens every year on July 11 now is unbelievable. When I went there, I had to have a bodyguard with me. When that bodyguard went to pray, I had to go into a bunker because of concerns and issues that still take place. There are thousands of people in this graveyard, over 8,000 already, and small coffins are identified. There were over 500 the day I was there, and they are draped. The people refuse to take money from the United Nations or other organizations, and they do this every year. The coffin is passed above the heads of the people standing there. One does not move; the coffin moves. It makes its way, all the way, to the gravesite. I am raising this because lives do matter here, and acting and doing something is more. The longer we wait, the longer we call for a ceasefire, the more suffering there is, and that is not going to bring anybody back. That has to be the primary concern right now. The motion that we have is consistent with what we, as New Democrats, have been calling for since day one, which is to call for the ceasefire. That was, in the days of old, the usual position for Canada, to use our weight to help move others toward more peaceful solutions than what exist right now. Sadly, I know of families who have lost dozens of people in my riding and in other places because they lived together. To get the idea, Gaza itself is the size of Detroit. There is just nowhere people can go to be safe. We know now that starvation issue is at a high-water mark in many respects. People have resorted to eating pigeon food and grass. We have seen a rise of anti-Semitism in the past in this country, and I want to note that. I understand the pain and suffering because I have seen it in my own community, even long before this, when swastikas were painted on sidewalks or in front of people's homes. All that still exists in our society, and it is something we have to continue to fight against every single day. However, we are not going to be able to fix anything until there is a ceasefire. If we could help move other countries in that direction, then we could save lives. That is the most important thing I will continue to resort to in that regard. I have seen pictures of children in Egypt missing limbs, and some in our community are trying to see if they could bring them back here because they now have no other relatives; maybe they have a cousin here. The 1,000 cap is just unbelievably cruel. It is unbelievably cruel to give false hope for even those 1,000 people as they scramble, and we cannot get anybody over here. We talk about the people we are trying to bring here. Just like in the past, who are the Palestinians in my community? They are doctors, lawyers and health care professionals. They are also teachers, and workers. Those are the people contributing right now. The frustration of being helpless in this is very difficult for them and for their families. There is a guilt factor, especially with Ramadan right now. Here, they have access to fasting and have water and food later on. Their relatives or family friends do not know if they can contact them tomorrow, because if there is no cell phone or Internet service, they may not be able to connect with them. It brings me to an important point when it comes to civil society and collectivity, not only here. We have people like Donald Trump saying things like “finish the problem” versus what we have seen in the past, which was Canada using its weight to push the United States to call for ceasefires at different points in time. If we do not exercise that ability here in this chamber with this motion, then what do we stand for? We stand for, basically, calling ourselves out of the international equation of humanitarian relief. We have witnessed churches, synagogues and a mosque being vandalized over the last number of years. If we turn away from this now, as well, we are also going to witness Canada distancing itself from international responsibility where we can help out. Unfortunately, the sad thing about this, as a return, is that we cannot stop the damage done, but we can stop more. That is why I went to Srebrenica, and I want to finish with this. Senad was a Canadian who was from Bosnia and who served in the hospitals. He worked with me on this bill. Sadly, he died of leukemia. When we went there, the strongest message we heard, in our humility, was that at least Canada had a voice and that at least Canada did something. That was better than nothing. It was important enough for them to say thanks.

1525 words

Ms. Elizabeth May (Saanich—Gulf Islands, GP)

Mar/18/24 6:09:21 p.m.
Watch

Mr. Speaker, the words of the member for Windsor West moved and touched me. I would really love if it were absolutely true that, regardless of party, we were taking steps to see that this country does more, whatever we are capable of doing, in the heavy lifting to bring about peace. We know that peaceful solutions do not come without much diplomacy and much moral suasion to say we have to protect the lives of children and we defend the lives of Israeli and Palestinian children. I think this motion helps us to get there. Can my hon. colleague from Windsor West think of any other way that we can get partisanship out of our way, because it stands in the way of peace?

125 words

Mr. Brian Masse

Mar/18/24 6:10:21 p.m.
Watch

Mr. Speaker, the things we have to drive toward here are results and expectations. The clock is ticking every single day on individuals, and we do have some value and worth in this discussion. If we all truly believe in getting to that place, then time is going to measure us in terms of what we did not do in this chamber and the result of that ineffectiveness, which is currently the policy of the government. We must allow this motion to pass.

83 words

Mr. Kevin Lamoureux (Parliamentary Secretary to the Leader of the Government in the House of Commons, Lib.)

Mar/18/24 6:10:55 p.m.
Watch

Mr. Speaker, I would not try to frame the discussion of what is currently happening as being ineffective. If the member was listening to the Minister of Foreign Affairs earlier, she was very clear and her comments very much reflected what I believe are Canadian values. As we continue to move forward, we are listening to Canadians and looking at what our allied countries, in particular the G7, are doing. At the end of the day, with the heartache that Canadians are experiencing over this issue, such as, for example, the racial tensions that are picked up on, there is an important role for this chamber. To what degree has the NDP worked with all parties in this area to agree on a motion that would be passed by all?

130 words

Mr. Brian Masse

Mar/18/24 6:11:55 p.m.
Watch

Mr. Speaker, maybe the member is right. Liberals have been effective in burning up time when we could have saved lives. That is the real issue New Democrats have with them. We have called for a ceasefire consistent with what Canadian values used to be many decades ago, even under Liberal regimes. I was here for the debate when we were deciding whether to take part in the war in Iraq, and I can say there was never a point in time, in debates back and forth, we could escape the fact that we played some role with the UN or the United States or other democracies across the world. Today, the Liberals have sidelined our effectiveness and basically neutered our position internationally.

123 words

Mr. Shuvaloy Majumdar (Calgary Heritage, CPC)

Mar/18/24 6:12:44 p.m.
Watch

Mr. Speaker, I have spent years living under the rockets of Iranian-backed militias, so I have some experience in the question of how lives are saved. Saving lives is genuinely at the core of what we are all here to do, so I would take exception to the hon. member's presuming that there are members in this chamber who are not interested in the primacy of that. It is clear to Conservatives that Hamas terrorism upon Israelis and Hamas tyranny upon Palestinians describes that the responsibility of the conflict today rests on the shoulders of Hamas. The pressure should be placed on Hamas and Iran rather than the democratic State of Israel for which the International Court of Justice found no act or culpability of genocide. Do New Democrats believe that the Iranian-backed Hamas should release the hostages, lay down their arms and unconditionally surrender? Does the member agree that this would be the quickest way to save lives and end the conflict right now, yes or no?

171 words

Mr. Brian Masse

Mar/18/24 6:13:50 p.m.
Watch

Mr. Speaker, of course, we want Hamas to no longer inflict violence, and never ever should any other result be presumed. However, at the same time and in the meantime, killing children and women disproportionately is not a solution. It is a consequence of the real math in terms of the geography, the weapons that are being used and where people can come and go. It is going to happen because the math has shown consistently, since this started, that this will be the end result. We have seen that with humanitarian aid workers and with children, mothers, fathers and other family members being wiped out in clusters because they live together. The math is all there. That is the problem with assuming we can allow all that to happen. That is just not a good way forward.

139 words

The Deputy Speaker

Mar/18/24 6:14:53 p.m.
Watch

Let us keep the questions and answers really short, so more people can participate. We got three done, just like the time before. We'll move on to the next speech. Resuming debate, the hon. Parliamentary Secretary to the President of the Treasury Board.

44 words

Mr. Anthony Housefather (Parliamentary Secretary to the President of the Treasury Board, Lib.)

Mar/18/24 6:15:13 p.m.
Watch

Mr. Speaker, I am a Canadian. I am a Jew. I am a Zionist. I am proud to have been born in this country. I am proud that my family came here in the 19th century and helped to build this country. My family members fought in World War I and World War II. We are part of Canada and lucky to be so. I have represented Canada in swimming internationally. I have represented Canada as a parliamentarian. There is no place in the world I want to be other than in Canada. The Jewish community, of which I am part, is a religious community that has existed for thousands of years, but we are also a people. Since we have been here in 1760, we have helped build this country. We got enormous opportunities, more than we've received anywhere else in history. In academia, law, medicine, physics, science, sports and journalism, we have helped build this country. Ninety-five per cent of Canadian Jews are Zionists. Zionism means we believe that we have a right to have one Jewish state in our ancestral homeland. Jews are indigenous to Israel. We have a history where Jews have faced persecution in every country in the world. We were expelled from England in 1290. We were expelled from Spain and Portugal in the 1490s. We faced the Crusades, where people were killed. We were put in ghettos throughout Europe. We faced the Holocaust. Jews were expelled from Arab lands in the forties, fifties, sixties and seventies. We needed one place where every Jew in the world knew that, if things went wrong in their country, they could go. That is Israel. That is what Zionism means. I get horrible threats and emails saying that I am a dirty Zionist, instead of a dirty Jew, but this is what Zionism means. There are all these demonstrations around the country outside of synagogues, outside of Jewish schools and outside of Jewish community centres, where people are screaming about how horrible Zionists are. I am a Zionist. I am not embarrassed or ashamed of being a Zionist. Canadian Jews should not have to live through what we are living through right now. My community is terrified. We are being intimidated over and over by people protesting outside of Jewish buildings. Canadian Jews have no control over what happens in the State of Israel, yet, for some reason, Jewish buildings across this country are being targeted. In my own riding, at the Jewish community offices, where the Jewish Public Library and the Holocaust museum are located, demonstrators went on private property, surrounded the building, blocked access to the building and blocked anyone from leaving for over three hours. This is happening all over the place. The demonstrators, while they are allowed and right to demonstrate wherever they want, cannot go on private property and cannot block other people from exercising their right to free speech. If I cannot enter a building to hear a speaker and they block me, yell at me, scream at me and stop me from going in, then their rights are infringing on my rights. The police need to step in and act as police. All leaders across this country need to tell them to do so, because this is not fair. It is too much. Jewish Canadians do not deserve this. Jewish students have told me of horrible stories happening on campuses across this country, from British Columbia to Newfoundland, about being intimidated on campus, about walking into dormitories and having anti-Israel slogans on the walls. They walk into a building and they are asked if they are a Zionist. If they are Zionist, supposedly they are not allowed into their dorm. This is not Canada. This is not the country that I know and love. Nobody should be forced to feel this way. This is how I get to this motion. Right now the Jewish community is demoralized and intimidated. This motion would create one winner and one loser. Most Canadian Muslims will vastly support this motion. They are feeling lots of pain right now, watching the events that are happening in Gaza. If this motion is adopted, Canadian Jews will feel tremendous pain because the way the motion is constructed would clearly create a false equivalency between the State of Israel and the terrorist organization Hamas. In the event that we want this war to end, Hamas can easily lay down arms and surrender, return the hostages and stop using citizens of Gaza as human shields. Essentially, while I appreciate my colleagues in the NDP, this motion, as some other colleagues have said, rewards Hamas. We, for generations in Canada, under successive Liberal and Conservative governments, have said that the way to recognize a Palestinian state, which we all want, living in peace side by side with Israel and to offer dignity to both peoples should come when the two parties negotiate their borders and the Palestinians elect a government to govern that territory. The West Bank is governed by Fatah, which has been in power without an election for 20 years. Mr. Abbas was elected in 2004. On the other side, in Gaza, there is a terrorist organization, Hamas, that has not held elections since 2007 and is recognized by Canada as being a terrorist organization. Hamas launched the deadliest attack on Israel, the deadliest pogrom against Jews since the Holocaust, and we would be changing our foreign policy to reward Hamas and say, “Good for you, terrorists. You attacked a sovereign state, killed lots of people, including babies, women and everyone else, raped, pillaged and brought people back as hostages, who have now been there for almost five months. Let us recognize that state that we have never recognized before.” What a great idea for other places in the world where terrorism foments. Who would love this? Iran would love this, because Iran is the people in the Middle East who are fomenting terrorism everywhere. Whether it is Hezbollah in the north or Hamas in the south, Iran is supporting this and loving every minute as the world tears itself apart to criticize Israel instead of focusing on Iran and its regime. When we talk about arms sales, let us first recognize that the American government supplies billions of dollars of arms to Israel. Canada and the Canadian government do not sell arms to Israel directly. We have provided, for many years, only non-lethal weapons, because nobody has applied for lethal weapon permits, and these non-lethal weapons are going to a friend and ally, Israel, at a time of war. We can imagine what the world would look like if all the countries in the world, which I presume is the principle of the motion, said they would not ship arms or even non-lethal weapons to Israel, while Hamas and Hezbollah would continue to get their weapons from Iran through Egypt and through Lebanon. Israel, while it has missiles launched at it from Hezbollah in the north and Hamas in the south, would be unable to fight back and would be bereft of weapons. That is the false equivalency that we are now making between Hamas, a terrorist organization, and Israel. I do not think this motion goes toward furthering anything toward peace. In fact, it would do the opposite. It would tell our friend and ally that it is being treated in a different way than the terrorist organization, which is benefiting from weapons being shipped to it. I had the opportunity, with the member for Calgary Nose Hill, the member for Eglinton—Lawrence, the member for Thornhill and the member for Charleswood—St. James—Assiniboia—Headingley, to visit Israel. We saw the wreck and the destruction of Hamas. We visited a kibbutz, where we saw buildings burned and people who had been burned to death in their safe rooms. We saw blood splattered all over the place and houses ransacked. We heard from people who had been terrorized. Members have to understand that Israel feels that, if it does not destroy the terrorist group Hamas, there will be another pogrom that kills more Israelis tomorrow, the next week or the next month. I understand how horrible it is to see the situation in Gaza. I understand how the world looks at it with revulsion as we see people dying, but we also have to understand that a democratic nation has been, on many occasions, attacked and had wars started against it, and now all sides in Israel feel they need to fight back. I stand with Israel, our democratic ally and our friend. A time of war is when we look at countries and ask if they stand with our ally or not. Canada should be standing with Israel. Canada should be defending the right of Israel to fight back against a terrorist organization. We should not be passing motions that make a terrorist organization equivalent to a democratic state.

1506 words

Ms. Leah Gazan (Winnipeg Centre, NDP)

Mar/18/24 6:24:56 p.m.
Watch

Mr. Speaker, I have to say, as a Jew, listening to my colleague across the way talk about our view as Jews as universal, in terms of our position on Israel, is extremely painful. I know that his position comes from a place of deep intergenerational trauma and the experience of genocide, including what my family went through. I acknowledge that, but I want to ask the member across the way this: When he sees a child, because we know over 30,000 people in Gaza who have been murdered are women and children, does he see Hamas or does he see a child? What I see are fellow human beings. I do not see a Palestinian. I do not see a Jew. I see a human being, and I am wondering if he supports peace with the purpose of stopping the murder of children.

145 words

Mr. Anthony Housefather

Mar/18/24 6:26:12 p.m.
Watch

Mr. Speaker, any death of a human being is a tragedy. We are getting statistics, and the hon. member mentioned the figure of 30,000 from the Hamas ministry of health, but I do not know how accurate that is. I do know that many of those people are Hamas fighters. Of course, there are innocent civilians killed in wars, and we feel horrible for the fact that they are innocent civilians. We have to call upon Israel to exercise maximum restraint. Of course, I would love to see a temporary ceasefire for six weeks, for example, as called for by the Americans, but Hamas needs to agree. We have had Hamas break previous ceasefires. We have had Hamas refuse to release the hostages, and until those hostages are released, it is very unfair to say to Israel, “Leave your people in tunnels under Gaza forever”, which I think is essentially being called for in the motion before us.

161 words

Mr. Pat Kelly (Calgary Rocky Ridge, CPC)

Mar/18/24 6:27:10 p.m.
Watch

Mr. Speaker, does the member think that an opposition motion from the fourth party in this chamber is the correct way for the foreign policy of Canada to be conducted and for decisions on recognition of statehood to be made?

40 words