44th Parl. 1st Sess.
November 24, 2023 10:00AM
Mr. Speaker, I look at Bill C-58 as a substantial piece of legislation that will make a wonderful difference for the labour movement, but not only the labour movement. I think we get lost in this in the sense that it is in the best interests of all, whether for labour or employers. I genuinely believe that. It is something I have been advocating for for many years.
My question for my colleague is in regard to the province of Quebec and the province of British Columbia. They have had this, in particular Quebec for many years now. Could he again reinforce the benefits that those two provinces have received by having back-to-work legislation? What are his thoughts in regard to why it is important that other provincial jurisdictions follow suit now that we have two provinces and the national government moving forward on anti-scab legislation?
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Mr. Speaker, it is a pleasure to rise today to talk about the anti-scab legislation. When one looks at page 22 of the Liberal Party platform from the last federal election, one will find a commitment that the Liberal Party made, under its current leadership, toward bringing forward anti-scab legislation. This is a fulfilment of that commitment.
It is really encouraging to have before us legislation that would have a very positive impact on our labour movement across the country, from coast to coast to coast. In fact, I hope that other provincial jurisdictions will look at what the provinces of British Columbia and Quebec have had in place for a number of years and, now, what the federal government is proposing within this bill to bring forward anti-scab legislation, and do likewise.
My daughter, who is the MLA for the Tyndall Park riding, through a throne speech, encouraged the provincial New Democratic Party in Manitoba to bring forward anti-scab legislation. Hopefully, my home province of Manitoba will in fact be the third province to bring it in.
I approach this legislation based on a number of factors. As a member of Parliament of Winnipeg's north end and a north-end MLA for almost 20 years, I have always looked at the issue of labour as important. In fact, one thing I would like to talk about is the general strike of 1919 in Winnipeg, which was a very historic strike for Canada as a nation. It lasted for six weeks, from mid-May to virtually the end of June, and I have had the opportunity to raise the 1919 general strike on several occasions.
I would like to highlight a couple of those. Back in 2019, I attempted to get recognition of that particular strike on the floor of the House. The first thing I will quote is that request. Before I do that, I want to emphasize that the boiling point of the 1919 strike was in good part over replacement workers. Today, we are debating anti-scab legislation, which is to prevent replacement workers, and this was a theme of the 1919 general strike in the city of Winnipeg.
I am going to go to May 7, 2019, where I stood in the House from this very seat and asked the following:
Mr. Speaker, I rise on a point of order, but first let me just recognize and appreciate the support from the member for Elmwood—Transcona.
There has been discussion among the parties and, if you seek it, I hope you will find unanimous consent for the following motion: that the House of Commons recognize the historical significance of the Winnipeg general strike of 1919, in particular on workers rights, human rights and social advocacy for over the past 100 years.
Unfortunately, we did not get unanimous consent in order to have that recognition, but I still thought it was an important issue to raise.
May 15 is a significant day; for all intents and purposes, it is when the general strike of 1919 started. On May 15, again, I stood in the House at this very same spot and said the following:
Mr. Speaker, it was a general strike. On May 15, 1919, the call was made for all workers to put down their tools at 11 a.m. The first to strike were the female telephone workers, who failed to show up for their 7 a.m. shift.
Today is the 100th anniversary of the 1919 Winnipeg strike. I want to acknowledge the importance of the labour movement in Canada. Unions matter. Unions represent people, people who work hard, support their families and contribute to their communities and our economy.
Today I thank those pioneers. The labour movement has been essential to promoting fairness and inclusion in our economy. Unions fight for the middle class and have been the driving force behind the exceptional progress made on behalf of women, LGBTQ workers, indigenous workers and workers with disabilities.
When we were elected, we committed to being a real partner with labour. We stand by that commitment, and we will keep working on behalf of the workers and Canada's middle class.
I said that back in 2019; I want to reinforce just how important it is. I often talk about the middle class on the floor of the House. It is something that the Prime Minister talked about even before he became the Prime Minister of Canada: supporting Canada's middle class.
One of the first actions we took was to repeal labour legislation of the Conservative Party, through private members. That was the member, and my colleague and friend, for the Kildonan riding, the minister of labour under the government at the time.
We have worked very closely with labour to ultimately be able to materialize a substantial piece of legislation. I appreciate the fact that the NDP and the Bloc party are going to be supporting this legislation. I would love to see the Conservative Party realize that the economy works better when one has harmony within the labour force.
There is nothing wrong with supporting anti-scab legislation. It is in everybody's best interest. I would ask my Conservative colleagues across the way to recognize that fact and support the legislation. It would send a very powerful message to everyone if, in fact, we could see that take place.
One does not need to say that this is an area that has never been explored before. As I said, the Province of British Columbia has had it for many years; the Province of Quebec has had it for many more, for decades.
I believe that the numbers and the stats clearly demonstrate that, in the end, we have seen more harmony in terms of labour relations in those provinces. This is a direct result of having anti-scab legislation, or at the very least, an indirect result.
I do not say that lightly, because it has been attempted before. I will go back to my home province of Manitoba. Back in 1988, when I was first elected, there was a big labour issue before the chamber. It was based on what they called final offer selection. This was, in essence, a compromise. The premier, Howard Pawley, had made a commitment years prior to the union movement to bring in anti-scab legislation. Well, he did not do so; instead, he brought in final offer selection as a compromise.
The final offer selection, in essence, said that the employer and employee would give their very best offer. The arbitrator would then have to choose one of the two; they could not mix it up in any way. That legislation had a sunset clause on it. That was the closest Manitoba ever came to having anti-scab legislation; it was that compromise.
I remember the debates quite well, because we would be going until two o'clock in the morning in standing committees. I remember the presentations by, in particular, labour movements and the different types of businesses that were coming before the Manitoba legislature.
It was a very heated discussion that took place. However, people lost sight of the bargaining table and the issue of collective bargaining.
There is not a level playing field when an employer is allowed to bring in replacement workers. That became very apparent in those discussions. At the time, we were the official opposition, and we felt we had to fight to keep final offer selection in place in the province of Manitoba, because we knew there was no way we were going to be able to get anti-scab legislation. If we could not get that, then we would stick with Howard Pawley's compromise of final offer selection. Unfortunately, we still lost that because of a lot of political manipulation.
I suspect that the Hansard of the Manitoba legislature back then would show that I was a very strong advocate, because I believe in, as much as possible, striving for labour harmony and supporting the collective bargaining system. This is why it goes as far back as 1988, and members will find that, with respect to labour issues, I often stand in the chamber, and often on behalf of many of my Liberal caucus colleagues. In fact, today, on behalf of all of my Liberal caucus colleagues, I am talking about how important it is to see the legislation before us pass, because we do not know what is on the horizon. Many, including myself, would like to think that we are going to be on this side for the next 10 years, but Canadians are going to have to make that decision. For now, we have an opportunity to do something very positive for the labour force and for business by getting behind the legislation. It is one of the ways in which we can actually support Canada's middle class.
If we go back to the 1919 general strike in Winnipeg, it was the grouping of the middle class that was feeling stepped on and that felt compelled to get engaged in the strike. Interestingly, what brought the strike to what I would suggest was an improper conclusion was when a trolley car that was being used for replacement workers came across from what used to be the old city hall, downtown on Main Street, where there were protests taking place for some of the union leaders who had actually been arrested. Strikers were there, and the trolley car was brought forward, which incited the workers. This incitement led to the trolley car's being turned over. The windows were smashed, and ultimately it was set on fire. People died as a result, not because of being burned but because of the actions that followed immediately after that.
There is a lot to be learned from history, and the Winnipeg General Strike had a profoundly positive impact on the labour movement in Canada. Many of the social programs we have today can be attributed to a lot of the strong labour personalities, and they came from different parties. It does not have to be made a political issue. Each and every one of us can be an advocate. Supporting the labour movement is supporting Canada's middle class and it is supporting our business community. If we learn from the past, we can recognize the value and importance of the bargaining table and of taking actions that would support the collective bargaining process. All one needs to do is look at the provinces of B.C. and Quebec. I truly believe it would provide, directly and indirectly, more labour harmony for Canada as a whole.
The federal legislation would not apply for a majority. The majority would be found within the provincial jurisdictions. I hope the federal legislation would embolden provincial legislatures. That is why I highlight the Province of Manitoba. I think it is in a good position to be able to advance legislation of this nature, because final offer selection died long ago, 30 years or more ago. Therefore, I am hoping the provinces will look at it and take tangible steps to make it happen. It takes away from bargaining, and anything that takes away from the bargaining table is a bad thing. It prolongs disputes. The costs to our economy are enormous. At the end of the day, having a system in place that encourages labour's bargaining with employers is a positive thing.
There are many mechanisms within the legislation itself that the Minister of Labour made reference to, and I would like to highlight a couple of them. Employers would be banned from hiring replacement workers during a strike or a lockout. That would mean, for example, that no new contractors or members of a bargaining unit could cross the picket line. Employers would be able to use replacement workers only to prevent threats to life, health and safety, or destruction or serious damage to property or the environment. If a union believes its employer is in violation of the ban, it would be able report it to the CIRB for an investigation. There would be a substantial penalty of $100,000 per day in certain situations. There would also be a maintenance of activities agreement, which is how employers and unions would agree on what work will continue during a strike or a lockout. It is a truce in the midst of a dispute.
There are a number of clauses within the legislation to reinforce its strength, so hopefully all members will get behind Bill C-58. I have listened to the New Democrats and members of the Bloc, who have some concerns. Let us get the bill to committee stage and see whether there are some amendments that could be brought forward. The government has demonstrated in the past that it is always open to the good ideas of individuals.
The Conservative leader often likes to talk about how he is there to represent union workers. If he is genuine in his comments, then I would hope the Conservative Party would join the Bloc; the NDP; the Greens, I expect; and the Liberals in voting in favour of the legislation. Unanimously supporting the legislation would send a powerful, positive message to all, in particular the labour movement. That would be my appeal to my colleagues across the way. Hopefully, they will respond to the appeal in a positive fashion and will think of the 1919 general strike and how it could impact some of the thinking on the whole process as we debate the bill.
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- Nov/24/23 10:54:32 a.m.
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Mr. Speaker, it is about regulating the industry. At the end of the day, I do not have a problem comparing labour negotiations to those of the federal government today. Over the last number of years, compared to Stephen Harper's time, we see there has been a great deal of collective bargaining and agreements signed off on. It is virtually night and day.
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- Nov/24/23 10:56:44 a.m.
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Mr. Speaker, I am a bit reluctant to get into an area that is fairly detailed. As I suggested, when the legislation goes to committee, I am sure the member would be able to ask some of the specifics. If he feels it is too long a period, then there is always the possibility of moving an amendment. A lot of it has to do with the background work that has been done on it. For example, the member is not necessarily aware of the discussions and debate that would have taken place among labour and management groups that thought it was the best time frame to put it in. I do not know those types of details. The member might even want to consider approaching the minister directly about the issue.
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- Nov/24/23 10:58:40 a.m.
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Mr. Speaker, I was being somewhat careful to make sure I did not turn this into a partisan issue, but the member has invited me to do so.
Let me remind the member that it was a Liberal government in B.C. that brought it in, a Liberal government in the province of Quebec that brought it in, and a Liberal commitment that was made in the last federal policy platform, on page 22. As for the NDP, I was in the Manitoba legislature when Howard Pawley, the NDP premier at the time, promised to bring in anti-scab legislation. He broke that promise and the NDP, over 20 years, has failed to bring in anti-scab legislation.
Just last week, my daughter, who happens to be a Liberal MLA, encouraged the NDP to bring it forward in a throne speech, which the current provincial government failed to do. However, I am optimistic that the new premier will in fact do what my daughter is suggesting and bring in anti-scab legislation at the provincial level.
By the way, the provincial jurisdiction impacts more workers than the federal legislation would, so I would hope that all provinces would do likewise and follow the national lead, along with B.C. and Quebec, and have anti-scab legislation.
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- Nov/24/23 11:24:03 a.m.
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Mr. Speaker, what is becoming clearer and clearer every day is that the Conservative leader of today is just not worth the risk. Quite frankly, the far right element of Canada has actually taken over the Conservative Party today. We saw that in the actions of all Conservative members voting against the Canada-Ukraine trade agreement. It is completely amazing. It shows a lack of leadership. The leader of the Conservative Party is moving it far to the right. It is inexcusable and shame on every Conservative member for joining with—
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- Nov/24/23 11:37:19 a.m.
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Mr. Speaker, we hear more and more that the leader of the Conservative Party is just not worth the risk. The bottom line is that the Conservatives might have supported the free trade agreement with Canada and Ukraine years ago, but just the other day, every one of them, with the leader of the Conservative Party leading the pack, voted against the Canada-Ukraine trade agreement.
There is no way they can get away from that fact. That is the reality. You have betrayed Ukraine and it is shameful the way you have conducted yourselves in the last couple of days.
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- Nov/24/23 12:17:30 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, I would ask that all questions be allowed to stand.
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- Nov/24/23 12:19:02 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, I suspect that if the member were to peruse Hansard to see exactly what I said, I said “in good part” replacement workers were the reason for the 1919 strike, especially the conclusion of it. A number of factors led to it, and in good part, it was about employers and a sense of exploitation at a time when there was inflation.
The member tries to compare it to today. It is important that we put things into proper perspective in the sense that, around the world, Canada's inflation rate is doing quite well in comparison. Having said that, we are moving in the right direction. In June 2022, it was over 8%. Now we are getting closer to 3%. We are moving in the right direction and we will continue to have Canadians' backs.
The other thing I would emphasize, based on the question the member asked, is in regard to Canada's middle class. Canada's middle class has been supported, whether through this legislation or middle-class tax breaks from the very beginning. People in the middle class know that this government has their backs in all ways.
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- Nov/24/23 12:21:10 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, I can appreciate the sensitivity of the question. I believe that once we get the bill into committee, there will be a more detailed, fulsome answer to that specific question. I suspect it has a lot to do with the making of the legislation and the people who were engaged in consultations. There may be some time-related issues.
I would encourage the member to go to the standing committee and put forward that question, or even approach the minister directly.
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- Nov/24/23 12:22:04 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, first and foremost, I believe it is in recognition of the importance of the free collective bargaining system and the importance of the bargaining table.
At the end of the day, when we think of labour rights, ultimately labour harmony is good for all of us. One of the things I would like to emphasize, as this is my last answer, is for us to think of the social impact that labour has had here in Canada from coast to coast to coast, which has been tremendously positive.
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