Hon. Leo Housakos: Minister, it’s clear that the way I measure progress on foreign interference and the way you measure progress are very different. The truth of the matter is there is a piece of legislation in this chamber — a chamber that is filled with government appointees. You know that if there were a political will to move that legislation to committee, review it, amend it and get it back to the House, it could be done very quickly.

This is just another example of why the government is dragging its feet when it comes to foreign interference.

I will ask two simple questions, which reiterate the fact that the government is dragging its feet. When will the illegal Beijing police stations operating in Canada, confirmed by the RCMP, be shut down? By what date will we have a foreign registry put in place in this country? Hopefully, it is before the end of 2023.

Hon. Leo Housakos: Minister, here we are again, the exact same spot as one year ago. I asked you then about my bill for a foreign agent registry. You said it was a good idea, but clearly you kicked the can down the road. I suspect, minister, we will be here again next year this time still kicking this can down the road given the fact that you committed to tabling legislation only in the fall.

You claimed months ago that the RCMP had shut down illegal People’s Republic of China police stations in Canada. Two stations in Montreal actually remain open, and we now know they received funding from your own government. Why were we led to believe those stations had been shut down? Did the RCMP lie to you, minister, or did you take creative licence with the truth? Is it incompetence on behalf of the RCMP or does the incompetence lie with you?

Senator Housakos: Minister, that’s very reassuring, actually. I appreciate that answer. It’s a good first step to recognize foreign interference and influence in various institutions in this country by various nefarious states around the world.

Would your government be supportive of a foreign influence registry, as proposed in Bill S-237 tabled in this chamber, that would force agents acting on behalf of foreign states and trying to influence our institutions and our democracies to register in the proposed registry so they are transparent and accountable?

I agree that this is a pressing and urgent issue and that we have to be vigilant and that we should be open to considering all of the tools so that our national security apparatus can protect our national security both here and abroad.

Hon. Leo Housakos (Acting Leader of the Opposition): Minister, you are now the third minister for public safety to hold this portfolio since the Trudeau government began its 5G security review in September 2018. Multiple times since, your government has promised Canadians that a decision was coming in regard to banning Huawei from our 5G. We were told that we would get a decision before the 2019 election, and we were told again that we would get a decision after the 2019 election. Of course, we’re still waiting.

The endless delay and indecision from your government has gotten to the point that, earlier this month, Huawei actually trolled your government on Twitter asking, “What’s the opposite of being banned?” The Government of Canada is being openly mocked by Huawei, minister, and still we have heard nothing from the government. Minister, when will the NDP-Liberal government come to a decision, yes or no? Will we ban Huawei once and for all?

Senator Housakos: Thank you, minister. Clearly, you do not appreciate the urgency because it has been three years and we’re still waiting for a clear and unequivocal answer on whether we will ban them or we won’t.

In December, The Washington Post reported 100 confidential PowerPoint presentations that lay out Huawei’s participation in mass surveillance of Chinese people by their communist regime, including the local tracking of political persons of interest. The document also shows how Huawei is involved in human rights violations against the Uighurs in Xianjing province through surveillance, cameras and facial recognition. One document appears to show that Huawei did technology design work on their prisons. Is this not enough reason to ban Huawei, minister? If this is not reason enough, what will it take for your government to ban them? And, please, it should not take three or four more years until we get a final decision.

I want to assure you that as we undertake a careful review of all of the factors that go into this important decision that we are not sitting idle, that we are deploying a number of strategies and countermeasures to ensure that any hostile actors, be they state or non-state, are being mitigated and addressed in real time. We’ve made significant investments into our national security apparatus with the various agencies that report to my portfolio, as well as others within government, so that as we leverage the new technologies and innovations that are important to keep Canadians and others connected through the internet and cyberspace we are doing so in a way that recognizes that there have been evolutions to the threat landscape, including those which may be perpetrated by hostile state actors. We’re very mindful of the concerns that you have expressed. We do recognize that there is an expectation and an urgency to communicating the decision and we will do so as quickly as we can.

Hon. Leo Housakos (Acting Leader of the Opposition): Minister, last week, your colleague the Minister of Foreign Affairs was asked during a House of Commons committee meeting if she believed that Canada experienced foreign interference by state or state-backed actors in last year’s federal election. Minister Joly declined to answer, saying the matter was under the purview of the Minister of Public Safety.

So I will ask this of you, minister: Do you believe Canada experienced foreign interference by state or state-backed actors in the last federal election? If you agree that it took place, where will you lay the blame for this interference, and what will your government do to take action and prevent this in the future?