The Hon. the Speaker: Honourable senators, it is now 2:30, and the Senate will proceed to Question Period. The minister has taken his seat, so we will now proceed.

Hon. Senators: Agreed.

(At 3:51 p.m., the Senate was continued until tomorrow at 2 p.m.)

The Hon. the Speaker: Is it your pleasure, honourable senators, to adopt the motion?

Hon. Bill Blair, P.C., M.P., Minister of National Defence: Thank you very much, Senator Plett, for the question. Thank you also, ladies and gentlemen, for the privilege and the opportunity to come before you today.

In the aftermath of the terrible attack and the murder of innocents that took place on October 7, there was, very importantly, a reaction. I think that we have been very clear on the government’s position with respect to affirming Israel’s right to defend itself. As a result of the bombing of the hospital that took place in Gaza, there were a lot of questions and, I think, a lot of misinformation with respect to what had taken place there.

I met with my officials at the Department of National Defence and the Canadian Armed Forces, and I asked them for a close examination of the ballistics of the event and the trajectory of the ammunition. They examined both the open-source information and the classified material that was available to us. Then, I had the opportunity to brief the Prime Minister on this matter on that Saturday afternoon, and, after briefing the Prime Minister, I made a public statement.

Senator, I would respectfully disagree with your characterization. I think the Prime Minister reacted in a very understandable way to the explosion that took place at that hospital and the loss of innocent life.

Hon. Bill Blair, P.C., M.P., Minister of National Defence: Thank you very much, Senator Marshall.

I would point out, senator, that I was recently appointed to this position. Although I work closely with my predecessor, Minister Anand — and I continue to work very closely with her — upon my arrival into that portfolio, I undertook a comprehensive review. I had previously seen some of the planning that had gone into the Strong, Secure, Engaged defence policy update in a different capacity — I was the chair of the security committee for cabinet. However, having gone in there, I have been working very closely with the Department of National Defence, the Treasury Board and our government in determining the right way forward. There have been some changing circumstances. There has also been extensive consultation with not just the Canadian Armed Forces, but also with industry. I have been meeting with them as well because, in many respects, the defence policy update is also industrial policy — it’s not just defence policy in my opinion — so I have been engaging with them as well.

I understand the importance of coming forward with that defence policy update. We are working on it very diligently, and I hope to have good news about that in the not-too-distant future.

The Hon. the Speaker: Thank you, minister.

Hon. Tony Loffreda: Minister Blair, thank you for joining us today.

Canada’s military and peacekeeping legacy is something that we should all be proud of. I, for one, felt much pride this summer when I joined hundreds of volunteers, military personnel and supporters in Sicily for the Walk for Remembrance & Peace in honour of the eightieth anniversary of Operation Husky. This rich history is worth celebrating, and I feel that commemorations of this nature are a great way of instilling pride in our fellow citizens.

Would you not agree that these types of events can also serve as a recruitment tool for the forces? More broadly, can you share with us the Canadian Armed Forces’ recruitment efforts, and how the department is modernizing the recruitment process to simplify and shorten the application process for candidates?

Hon. Bill Blair, P.C., M.P., Minister of National Defence: Thank you very much, senator.

First of all, let me acknowledge your initial comments. I believe those commemorations are important. It is important that we honour our history. I think the Canadian Armed Forces has a long and proud history with the incredible work they have done, and the service and sacrifice of their members. That history needs to not only be commemorated, but it is also a great opportunity, I think, to encourage young people — the talent that we need in the Canadian Armed Forces — to consider a career in the Canadian Armed Forces. I believe it is a very proud and noble profession, and we need to promote that.

There is a real challenge, sir — as I’m sure you are aware — in the Canadian Armed Forces. Over the last three years, we’ve actually seen a greater attrition — more people are leaving the forces than the Canadian Armed Forces has been able to recruit. I think that may be the greatest challenge that I face as the new defence minister — doing everything I can to support the Canadian Armed Forces in their efforts to recruit the talent we need and, just as importantly, to retain the excellent people they already have. I have asked them to look very carefully at some of the impediments to recruitment and how long things have taken — background checks, for example.

I’ll give you an example: Last year, in December 2022, my predecessor announced that we were going to open up Canadian Armed Forces recruitment to permanent residents of Canada. I think it’s a very appropriate and necessary opportunity. What we have not yet seen is a commensurate increase in the number of people. Almost 12,000 people indicated an interest. We need to move faster in our recruitment and onboarding processes.

Hon. Donald Neil Plett (Leader of the Opposition): Welcome, minister.

Minister, around ten o’clock at night on Saturday, October 21, you released a statement indicating that the Government of Canada does not believe Israel struck a hospital in Gaza earlier that week. After initial media reports blamed Israel for attacking the hospital, Prime Minister Trudeau made sure his rush to judgment was in the full light of day and in front of reporters. The timing of his comments implied that he believed Israel was responsible, which, of course, was the story spread by Hamas.

After your statement, minister — and many of us here agreed with your statement that Saturday night — the Prime Minister went days without saying a word about it. Why is that, minister?

Hon. Elizabeth Marshall: Minister, welcome to the Senate of Canada.

Shortly after Russia’s invasion of Ukraine last year, Canadians were told there would be an urgent review of your government’s defence policy: Strong, Secure, Engaged. There was an indication that the updated policy would be released this past summer. However, we have yet to see it. In September, there was a media report that the rewrite of the new policy had been sent back to National Defence for further revisions.

Minister, why is the updating of the defence policy taking so long? What is the cause of the delay?

The Hon. the Speaker: Thank you, minister.

Hon. Bill Blair, P.C., M.P., Minister of National Defence: Thank you, senator. I remain absolutely committed to doing everything we can. I met have with Minister Umerov, who is the Ukrainian defence minister, and President Zelenskyy three times in the last two months. We are part of the Ukraine Defense Contact Group and have been responding, in every case, to what they have asked of us. One of the conversations I had with Minister Umerov was about having proper winter equipment because they knew they were going into a winter campaign. We were able to quickly respond with $25 million in winter equipment, including uniforms, sleeping bags, tents and boots, which is what they said they needed.

We also talked to them about making sure they were properly fitting uniforms. When we talked about that, we made a commitment of 2,000 uniforms. They will need more, but there are a number of different needs that Canada has been responding to. I would also point out that just a few weeks ago we announced that we were making a commitment of $650 million for light armoured vehicles, and specifically, the Ukrainians told us they needed armoured medevac vehicles, so we have included those as well.

The challenge I face is that the Canadian Armed Forces need that equipment, too. They need those light armoured vehicles and those investments. On the one hand, I remain resolute in our commitment to support Ukraine, and on the other hand, I have to continue to support the Canadian Armed Forces.

Senator R. Patterson: When you are engaging with your departmental officials and the ministry and armed forces in Ukraine on proper equipment for women soldiers, would you also investigate what Canada can do to support other gender and sex-specific considerations to keep those Ukrainian women soldiers in the fight? I’m talking about military considerations to maintain women’s health in the field. We have an expertise in that area.

Hon. Bill Blair, P.C., M.P., Minister of National Defence: Thank you very much, senator. It’s a very important question. The Canadian Armed Forces and the Minister of National Defence have a great deal of priorities right now, but none is greater for me than our important work in maintaining Arctic sovereignty and the investments we have to make in the North.

As you rightfully pointed out, we have made a commitment of $38.6 billion to NORAD modernization, but a very significant portion of that — part will be for investments in over-the-horizon radar and other things — will include a $122 million contract to strengthen Canadian Forces in Alert. It also includes the purchase of offshore patrol ships, of which four of six have been delivered and are available for patrol. I recently met with Duane Smith from the Inuit Nunangat area, as well. Those conversations are also very important.

As part of our commitment on the expenditure of the $38.6 billion for NORAD modernization, there is a commitment in that as well for Indigenous procurement for as much as 5% of that money. I will share with you that I’ve travelled to the Yukon and talked to the territorial government and the First Nations and Inuit governments there about Arctic sovereignty and the work of the Canadian Armed Forces in their region, and they have made it clear that sovereignty for them is investment in airports, highways and infrastructure. We’re committed to doing that.

Hon. Pierre J. Dalphond: Welcome, minister. In June, before you became defence minister, the government released the co‑developed action plan to implement the United Nations Declaration on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples, or UNDRIP, principles. Substantial sections are related to defence, imposing several responsibilities on your department. One of them is to collaborate with the Inuit Treaty Organizations to jointly identify Inuit-specific priorities and considerations for inclusion, where feasible, in National Defence policies, programs and initiatives. These matters are to be jointly identified by the partners, whose focus includes Inuit Nunangat, being the northern regions where Inuit traditionally live in the country. Minister, how is this work proceeding? How is the meaningful consultation engaged and the partnership developed?

Hon. Rebecca Patterson: Welcome, minister. With everything going on geopolitically, we can’t lose sight of the ongoing Russian aggression against Ukraine. My question today has to do with Canada’s continued support for Ukraine, specifically the donation of clothing and equipment you announced on October 11.

At that time, you announced 2,000 uniforms for women Ukrainian soldiers, and this was a welcome announcement. However, there are approximately 40,000 women in the Ukrainian army, with many fighting on the front lines in this grinding war of attrition, and they need to stay in the fight. We know these women are short of properly fitting uniforms and gender accommodating personal protective equipment, such as body armour.

Canada’s experience in combat has shown us that properly fitting equipment saves lives. But, frankly, 2,000 uniforms are a drop in the bucket of what women soldiers actually need. In your announcement, there was no mention of other personal protective equipment.

Minister, will you commit to engage with your officials and with industry to investigate providing full combat kits, which are desperately needed for those Ukrainian women soldiers?

Hon. Pat Duncan: Earlier this year, we experienced a foreign object in Canadian airspace over the Yukon. This experience re‑emphasized our dependence on the Alaskans and our Canadian Rangers, who are active and present in every Yukon community. Canada’s commitment to Arctic security in the North is focused on increased funding to the North American Aerospace Defense Command, or NORAD, National Defence and human resources at Joint Task Force North in Yellowknife. The Yukon has three Canadian Armed Forces staff stationed at Camp Boyle Barracks in Whitehorse.

In February, I wrote to your predecessor and asked that an office be centrally located to provide your department with a greater profile and ability to respond in a fulsome manner when needed. I have yet to receive an answer. Minister, are you aware of the minimal presence of the department in the Yukon? What, if anything, is the department doing to increase their presence and capabilities in the Yukon?

Hon. Bill Blair, P.C., M.P., Minister of National Defence: Thank you very much for the question. Providing support to military families is one of the most important things we need to do in order to improve the retention of the talent that we have and recruit new people into our organization.

I have travelled to the bases, and at every place I go, I try to spend time with the men and women who work there to give them an opportunity, first of all, to talk about the work that they are so proud of but also about some of the challenges they are facing. And, like in many parts of the country, I am hearing clearly that Canadian Armed Forces members are struggling with access to affordable housing, and that becomes a real priority. Although we have a budget of $55 million, it is not nearly enough to respond to what I believe to be almost a 7,000-housing unit deficit for the Canadian Armed Forces.

As I have been travelling to each of those bases, I also see the local municipality and work with the mayors. I have gone to the Minister of Housing, Infrastructure and Communities. As you are aware, the government is making significant investment in housing acceleration across the country, and I want to ensure that it also deals with the housing deficit that exists for our Canadian Armed Forces members.

We have also made significant investments across the country in child care. That is another huge challenge for military families, and so we have been providing money to the provinces, but the provinces don’t necessarily see it as their responsibility to support Armed Forces members and their families. I want to make sure that that investment is reflected in the provision of those important services to Canadian Armed Forces members.

Hon. Bill Blair, P.C., M.P., Minister of National Defence: Thank you very much, Senator Dalphond. I have some good news on that. I met earlier this week with the Inuit Treaty Organization. It was a meeting chaired jointly by Natan Obed and my colleague Minister Gary Anandasangaree. There were a number of discussions that took place with respect to our UNDRIP commitments with respect to the military. And as I spoke earlier, one of the Indigenous leaders we had met with earlier this week, I met yesterday with his team, and we talked about how we can work more collaboratively and consultatively with Inuit leadership, working with the Nunangat in order to fulfill our obligations.

Senator, I want to assure you we see this area as critically important, but every investment we make has to be done in close and proper consultation and collaboration so that, first of all, we would benefit from their knowledge of the territory but also take full advantage of their presence and capabilities within the region and allow us to invest in those capabilities.

We also discussed the important work that the Canadian Rangers do and why they are such an important part of the Canadian Armed Forces’ presence in the North, and that needs to be done also in consultation and close collaboration with the Inuit Treaty Organizations.

Hon. Bill Blair, P.C., M.P., Minister of National Defence: Thank you very much, senator. It’s not a situation that I am embarrassed by. It is something that I feel a strong responsibility to fix.

I have looked carefully at military procurement processes. They have, over the past many years, become bureaucratic, overly lengthy, and the fact is that we do provide money for the procurement of the equipment and the kit and the gear that our members need and were unable to acquire. I’ve already met with the Minister of Public Services and Procurement but also the Minister of Innovation, Science and Industry, and I am working with my deputy minister at National Defence to look at those processes and find ways in which we can expedite those procurement processes. It’s always important that we spend Canadian tax dollars carefully and create the best value for each of those dollars spent, but at the same time, the processes of that procurement — I have asked our officials to begin looking through those very carefully to find ways to expedite those matters.

I have also met with industry because they are a very important part of those procurement processes. We know that we have to make significant new investments, for example, in the manufacture of munitions, and we’re working closely with our aerospace and shipbuilding industries. We want to make sure those processes work for the Canadian Armed Forces and for Canadians.

[Translation]

Hon. Claude Carignan: Minister, despite the fact that our soldiers have outdated equipment that does not guarantee their safety like it should, your department is leaving billions of dollars on the table every year by failing to streamline the procurement process.

In 2021, $1 billion of the $5 billion that was allocated to the Canadian military remained on the table. According to the Parliamentary Budget Officer, if that trend continues, National Defence will be leaving on the table at least $4 billion of the $10.8 billion that it was allocated to buy equipment during the 2023-24 fiscal year.

Even more embarrassingly, our soldiers sometimes have to buy their own equipment. Denmark has and uses state-of-the art equipment that is made in Canada that our own soldiers don’t even have access to.

Minister, what tangible measures have you taken to address this unacceptable situation?

[English]