Senator Loffreda: One statistic suggests that 50% of international students do not file a tax return post graduation, so that means we’re not retaining 50% of the students. What policies or targeted measures have the government implemented to recruit the best young talent from abroad, including international students?

I think we should monitor and keep track of the international students who are leaving Canada. We’re not doing that. I did make mention of that recently.

There are some concerns. Canada is struggling to keep this international pool of talent, and I think we should make a huge effort to try to retain this talent in Canada. Is there a specific strategy or strategies that you know of or have spoken to the government about or that you will speak to the government about to retain this talent?

Senator Gold: Thank you, Senator Martin, for your question. On behalf of the government, I can say that I do not accept the premise of your question. This government is serious. Our credit rating, our job creation rate, the strength of our economy in various sectors and our ability to have recovered are thanks in no small measure to the investments that the federal government, as well as provincial governments, made, and the efforts of all Canadians.

This government is convinced that it is on the right course to position Canada to take advantage of the opportunities in this challenging world.

Senator Gold: I can certainly answer yes to one of the last questions. I will certainly make inquiries. I’m not aware of specific programs, but I will say this: The amount of study permit holders in Canada has increased significantly, from 122,000 in 2000 to 642,000 in 2019. There is a large pool that we can hope to retain for the benefit of our country.

Moving forward, the government plans to address labour shortages by welcoming talented workers to Canada, including support for their training, youth employment programs and addressing the specific needs of the evolving sectors. Indeed, I’m advised that the government’s Immigration Levels Plan for 2022-24 aspires to continue to welcome immigrants at a historic rate.

I will make inquiries about the specific programs that may exist for retention and get back to you as quickly as I can.

[Translation]

Hon. Marie-Françoise Mégie: Honourable senators, my question is for the Government Representative in the Senate. According to an article by investigative journalist Brigitte Bureau published on CBC this morning, one in four migrants, including children, ends up in prison.

Human Rights Watch and Amnesty International put out a report in June 2021 that looks into the detention of migrants in Canada and documents serious human rights violations. The report also makes the following six recommendations to the government:

Gradually abolish immigration detention.

End the use of solitary confinement in immigration detention.

Establish an independent body responsible for overseeing and investigating CBSA . . . .

Sign and ratify the Optional Protocol to the Convention against Torture and Other Cruel, Inhuman or Degrading Treatment or Punishment . . . .

Conduct a national independent review of the immigration detention system . . . .

Withdraw Canada’s declaration and reservation to Article 12 of the Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities.

Does the government plan to implement the six recommendations made last year, and what timeline has it set to follow through on its commitments? If not, why not? Thank you.

Hon. Marc Gold (Government Representative in the Senate): Canada has a strong and fair refugee system that ensures the security of our borders and at the same time provides protection to those who need it. I have been assured that the detention of immigrants is a measure of last resort.

I have also been told that the government is making significant progress towards reform by implementing fundamental elements and the National Immigration Detention Framework to address the recommendations you highlighted, such as introducing a ministerial direction to end the housing of minors, ensuring that alternatives to detention are always considered first, developing health services and general conditions in immigration holding centres and reducing reliance on provincial facilities. The government recognizes that there is still work to be done and has made a commitment to continue fighting for a robust and balanced immigration system.

Hon. Marty Klyne: Honourable senators, the 2019 mandate letter of the Minister of Canadian Heritage provided that the minister take steps to make the Royal Canadian Mounted Police Heritage Centre a national museum. The RCMP Heritage Centre is a magnificent building situated on the front lawn of the RCMP Depot Division — one of the most elite police training academies in the world.

The RCMP Heritage Centre is an incredible facility, telling the stories of the RCMP, the most unique police force in the world. With that comes difficult and good stories. All the same, that is our history; they are our stories. The RCMP is inextricably linked to the development of Western Canada, which presents many lessons to be learned and not forgotten.

However, the most recent mandate letter of the Minister of Canadian Heritage does not refer to making the RCMP Heritage Centre a national museum. Senator Gold, can you please update us on the progress of this file and clarify who the minister responsible is?

Hon. Leo Housakos: Thank you, Senator Black, for the question, and thank you for the notice you gave me of the question.

Yes, we have been discussing at length the inclusion of user-generated content in Bill C-11. Just yesterday, we heard directly from digital creators themselves, and we will hear from several more over the next few weeks. They have expressed their concerns that regulating user-generated content will put those digital creators at a possible huge disadvantage.

One of our witnesses testified yesterday that, as it stands right now, there is no gate keeping on a platform like YouTube. Anyone, including 4-H, as you have properly pointed out, can post their content, and they do not need government assistance to do so.

Mr. Justin Tomchuk testified that the internet is a level playing field for all Canadians who want to participate. As we continue our study of this bill, I’m concerned that, instead of removing barriers for marginalized voices and not-for-profit organizations like 4-H, we will be imposing barriers that are not currently there and creating an unequal playing field.

Senator Black, I want to thank you for your question and for raising this important point. I think our committee will agree that we should call 4-H to appear before our committee as we continue to call on independent digital and content providers. I also think it is imperative that our committee continues to drill down on this piece of legislation because — as we have gone through our pre-study and now our study — we are finding out there is a lot of light that needs to be shed in a lot of dark corners of this particular bill.

Also, given the fact that there was a lack of witnesses and scrutiny on the other side, where it was very politicized, it is imperative that we continue to do our due diligence. Thank you, senator.

Hon. Marc Gold (Government Representative in the Senate): Thank you for your question. The Government of Canada has worked hard, and continues to work hard, to ensure that Canada’s economy not only recovers from the strains that we all lived through with the pandemic but also emerges vigorous and stronger than ever. Indeed, the statistics demonstrate that.

The Government of Canada continues to invest, both in human capital and in infrastructure, to make sure that we are positioned to take advantage of the opportunities that face us in the 21st century. That includes a serious climate plan and the transition to a more resilient and sustainable economy.

Hon. Donald Neil Plett (Leader of the Opposition): Honourable senators, Canadian farmers are anticipating significant harvests of grain across the Prairies this fall, if it ever stops raining. That is an encouraging sign, given last year’s devastating drought, and it is something that could help ease sky-high food inflation. But Canada’s top grain companies are concerned that they will not be able to get their shipments to port on time due to what they are hearing from major rail companies. In the annual CN Grain Plan, the railway company warned that it expects total demand for rail services between Edmonton and the West Coast ports to exceed network capacity during some weeks.

Leader, Canadian farmers have dealt with the same issue year after year thanks to your government’s inaction in addressing our critical supply-chain issues. To help with this, I note that your government put together yet another task force in March, but you will forgive us and me on this side if we’re not all that encouraged.

When will your government finally act on this? When will you finally give Canadian farmers the break they deserve?

Hon. Marc Gold (Government Representative in the Senate): All Canadians are grateful to Canadian farmers for the work they do and the food they produce — not only for us but also to benefit our economy through our exports. The challenges facing farmers — weather, as you noted; rising costs; and the like — are well-known. The government has many programs in place, as I have outlined in this chamber, to help members of the agricultural sector make their way through these sometimes very challenging times.

This government will continue to take these issues seriously and will work as hard as it can to make sure that Canadian farmers and the industries they support prosper.

Senator Gold: The government supported, and indeed took over, a major pipeline because it recognizes the importance of that for our industry. Provincial premiers, at times, have been the ones to discourage infrastructure investments in that area. The government remains committed to helping all sectors of our economy prosper in this changing economic environment.

Hon. Donald Neil Plett (Leader of the Opposition): Senator Gold, in the wake of the murder of a 22-year-old woman in Iran and crackdowns on protests by the Iranian regime, calls for your government to list the Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps, or IRGC, as a terrorist entity have been renewed. In an interview on Monday, Foreign Affairs Minister Mélanie Joly was asked four times if your government is finally considering this. She avoided the question on all accounts. Let’s see if we have better luck with you, leader.

Your NDP-Liberal government has repeatedly failed to call the IRGC what it is. You failed to do so after Flight PS752 was shot down by Iran, claiming the lives of 55 Canadian citizens and 30 permanent residents. The families of the victims still do not have the long-demanded justice for the loss of their loved ones, and your promises to them have gone completely unfulfilled.

It still does not seem to be a consideration for your government, even now that a young woman is dead for failing to comply with the regime’s veiling laws, and women in Iran are protesting in the streets. I cannot say that I expected anything else from our fake feminist Prime Minister. Leader, what is your government waiting for? Why has it not listed the IRGC as a terrorist entity?

Hon. Marc Gold (Government Representative in the Senate): The Government of Canada, along with all Canadians, I fully hope and expect, condemns the reprehensible detention and killing of Mahsa Amini. Her death was the direct result of the systemic and continued harassment and repression of women by the authorities in Iran. Canada remains concerned, has condemned and will continue to condemn the actions of the Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps in the region. Canada has very robust measures to hold Iran to account. It has some of the toughest and most comprehensive sanctions in the world against Iran, and indeed, the IRGC-Quds Force is listed as a terrorist entity under the Criminal Code, as well as three Iran-backed regional militias.

Hon. Marc Gold (Government Representative in the Senate) tabled the reply to Question No. 43, dated November 23, 2021, appearing on the Order Paper and Notice Paper in the name of the Honourable Senator Plett, regarding forced labour — Global Affairs Canada.

Hon. Marc Gold (Government Representative in the Senate) tabled the reply to Question No. 43, dated November 23, 2021, appearing on the Order Paper and Notice Paper in the name of the Honourable Senator Plett, regarding forced labour — Public Safety Canada.

Hon. Patricia Bovey moved third reading of Bill S-208, An Act respecting the Declaration on the Essential Role of Artists and Creative Expression in Canada, as amended.

She said: Honourable senators, in speaking to third reading of this declaration on the essential role of artists and creative expression in Canada, I want to start with sincere thanks to, and on behalf of, Canada’s artists and arts organizations, as well as audiences from all corners of our country. The interest and support, and indeed, requests for this bill have resounded from artists and arts workers in all creative disciplines and from every region of Canada.

[Translation]

It was an honour to listen to their concerns and to work with them on developing this platform for a better understanding of their work and their value for Canada. This will be the foundation for developing the necessary policies for the arts, museums and performance halls, art galleries, workshops, publishing houses and more.

[English]

To the more than 600 people involved in my consultations, all of whom made poignant and insightful contributions to this declaration, I thank you.

Colleagues, as you know, these focus groups, meetings and interviews included individuals of all ages, from high school to those in their nineties; all art forms and sizes of organizations; Indigenous, Black, immigrant, non-Indigenous, disabled, francophone and anglophone people from every part of Canada — east, central, west, north, south, in large cities and rural and small communities. The discussions were heartfelt and based on their experiences, training and professions.

The conclusions embedded in this declaration cut to the chase as to the integral roles and impacts of the arts to Canadian society while emphasizing the critical needs of the sector — especially those needs to improve the often pitiful incomes of those involved.

I also want to thank the witnesses who appeared before the Social Affairs, Science and Technology Committee for their contributions to the whole. Their knowledge and passion and their expertise in and commitment to their work was of great help in coming to the unanimous conclusions we did.

[Translation]

To my colleagues who are members of the committee, thank you. Your interest, your questions and your sincere and profound perspectives have improved this declaration. I unreservedly support the amendments that further clarify the details of the original scope of this bill. Thank you for improving it.

[English]

Colleagues, as you know, this declaration, with its 10 points and implementation strategies, is intended to be the platform for much-needed policy revisions, updates and parameters for the creative sector in this country, which is the third-largest employer in our nation and yet one whose creators comprise the largest percentage of workers living below the poverty line. May it assist in addressing these realities and make the sector not only better within but increase its ability to serve every part of contemporary life in Canada.

As senators, we all know how intrinsic creative expression is to our whole and its truly positive impacts to our health and well‑being, crime prevention, reduction in recidivism rates, employment, economy, tourism, Canada’s international perceptions and standing, the environment, rural sustainability and, of course, our knowledge of who we are.

Indeed, the work and outcomes of every ministry are impacted.

It is trite, perhaps, to repeat that our artists portray who we are — our places, our ideas and our issues — but it is necessary to do so if we are to move the perception of the arts from frill to its rightful place as an anchor in our society. As former senator Murray Sinclair has said, and as I have quoted a number of times in various publications and, indeed, yesterday in this chamber, that art validates culture. At a time of working towards reconciliation, many of the necessary reconciliACTIONs are indeed culturally based.

[Translation]

I hope that this declaration will help Canadian society take these steps. The same goes for francophone, Black and immigrant communities, as set out in the amendments unanimously adopted by the Standing Senate Committee on Social Affairs, Science and Technology.

[English]

Alberta and B.C. artist Maxwell Bates wrote in 1962 of his own work:

I am an artist, who, for forty years,

Has stood at the lake edge,

Throwing stones in the lake

Sometimes, very faintly,

I hear a splash.

His splash was far greater than he realized and so too is the splash of Canada’s artists and arts organizations in all dimensions of all sizes. I hope this bill — this declaration — will be at least a faint splash in furthering the understanding and needs of the work and contributions of this insightful, innovative sector as it weaves all aspects of society together and leads us to a better place.

[Translation]

Senator Cormier described the complexity of the creative sector, and I agree. It is even more complex when it comes to museums and historical art. However, as I’ve said in this place, artists tell us so poignantly who we are, what we must cherish and what we must address as a society. As so many philosophers have affirmed, the arts nourish our souls, much like bread nourishes the body.

[English]

Parliamentary Poet Laureate Louise Halfe, an Indigenous poet from Saskatchewan, wrote two poems about the roots and needs of artists, indeed the underlying the purpose of this declaration. I asked her for one, and she came with two. The first one is called For Your Pleasure:

Black tie, evening gowns

blue jeans, funky dresses

people a line for the symphony,

theatre, a rock concert

or Leonard Cohen.

They stroll through a museum

view beadwork, paintings,

watch historical documents.

Walk from painting to painting

stall to stall at artisan sale.

Sit in awed silence

the cat ballerinas on stage

tap their feet at a fiddle dance,

admire colorful regalia and

chant with the pow-wow drums.

Their commissioned sculptures

command a street corner,

choirs at the symphony

commemorate veterans.

A tapestry of Canada Geese

feed in the prairie fields.

One of the group of seven

in a medical building.

Artists.

Working as waitresses,

ushers, bus or cab drivers,

shovel barn manure. Others

are lucky enough to have a spouse

to pay their rent.

The muse nibbles and nudges

their fingers

guides them

to a coffee shop, a studio,

to listen to the urge

to leave to you

a re-creation

of life.

She also wrote A Celebration of the Arts:

Poets, dancers, musicians, singers,

painters, paupers beg

on bleeding knees

at the foot of dreams. The muse

watches as the artists

push thigh deep through the

wingless angels in

a winter storms. In summer rains

they part the mist-filled fog

cup the tears of creativity.

Paupers living in squalor,

church basements,

taking refuge in libraries

to keep their bodies warm.

Work for pennies

to pay rent, buy macaroni,

sell their bodies, a few pieces of art,

words of poetry they recite

to four people.

Paupers unable to pay

for prescriptions, dental work,

glasses. Shop at the Sally Ann,

line up at the food banks.

There is no bank account, life

savings. No insurance. Bus pass.

If the paperwork for mingy grants

passes the muster of critical eyes

and serious competition

mouths will be fed.

Darkness is invasive

Consumes the heart with drugs,

alcohol binges and yet

the artists’ muse hangs on walls, dances

in theatres, sings on stage,

collects on shelves

while they feed on the leftovers.

People pass the busker’s

guitar, violin, or harmonica.

Making a living on finger bones.

Colleagues, I ask you to support the third reading of this bill and send it to the House of Commons quickly so their deliberations can begin and hopefully result in recognizing the value and importance of this sector. I ask you to remember my late husband’s mantra, which was, “We are all better off when we are all better off.” Canada’s artists and creative expression do make us better off, and they have the capacity to do so even more with the recognition this bill gives.

[Translation]

I again thank you for your attention and your support. Based on what I have heard from people on the ground all across the country, there is considerable enthusiasm about this Senate initiative with Bill S-208. I know that they will be truly grateful once the bill comes into force. Thank you.

[English]

Senator Plett: Thank you, Senator Bovey, for your speech and for your work on this bill, and indeed on an issue that you are very passionate about.

Senator Bovey, in your bill you referenced that the proposed declaration on the essential role of artists and creative expression in Canada emphasizes the need to respect and promote the role of artists and the arts in order to ensure that all Canadians and residents of Canada have equal opportunity to access and enjoy the fruits of artistic expressions.

In that context, Senator Bovey, I would appreciate your views about the concerns raised by the content creators of the government’s Bill C-11.

For instance, as you likely know, Nettwerk Music Group has stated that Bill C-11 would hurt Canadian artists and Canadian music companies, not help them. Independent filmmaker Justin Tomchuk told the Standing Senate Committee on Transport and Communications this week that, if passed, Bill C-11 would have an unintended negative impact on Canadian streamers attempting to market their content to a global audience.

Senator Bovey, are you concerned about the criticisms that have been raised? What is your opinion about whether Bill C-11 should be substantively amended to address these concerns?

Senator Bovey: To my Manitoba colleague, I want to say thank you. You have proven my point that the arts tie all elements of society together. I have to also say that, like you, I’m receiving lots of correspondence on Bill C-11.

Your Honour, I will be speaking about Bill C-11 in due course. I’m keeping up with the testimony given in the meetings of the Standing Senate Committee on Transport and Communications and I’m looking forward to reading more of it. Obviously, I have heard from many artists. Some of the 600 people I spoke with as we were developing this declaration underlined how important Bill C-11 was for their means of receiving revenue for the work they do.

I’m sure my honourable colleagues are well aware that a report came out recently that said that during COVID, Canada’s musicians who streamlined their work earned, on average, $67 a year. If I may, Bill C-11 has to go a long way to address that from the companies and from the payments made to it. I hope it will go to support the creators who are creating the content that goes on those streaming platforms.

If I may, Senator Plett, I will be talking to Bill C-11 directly.

Senator Plett: One brief follow-up, if the senator will indulge me.

First, I am looking forward to hearing her speech on Bill C-11, although I want to absolutely tell you that we, on this side, are not going to rush you in any way to make that speech. Take your time. Take whatever you need — a month, two or three. Make sure that you have a great speech for us whenever you get to it.

Senator Bovey, witnesses have told our committee that online streaming has led to unprecedented access by creators in rural and northern communities to a global marketplace. Again, I know that you will speak to it, but are you concerned, based upon what creators have told our committee, that Bill C-11 could undermine this global access?

Senator Bovey: I’m just back from the North, as you know. I was up in Gjoa Haven about a week or 10 days ago. To get to Gjoa Haven from Winnipeg, Senator Plett, as I’m sure that you are aware, you have to spend a day in Yellowknife. I had a nice route travelling there and then had an opportunity to meet with artists of all disciplines and arts organizations in Yellowknife. I subsequently spoke in Edmonton with many people who work in the arts sector in the rural communities of Alberta.

My concern for the rural communities is that they do not have the kind of access that the South has for a lot of this kind of creative work. If we can find a way — through Bill C-11, Bill S-208 and other initiatives that I hope will be taken — it is my hope that all Canadians in every corner of our country, of all languages and of all cultures will have the opportunity not only to engage in their own creative expression, but also to enjoy the creative expression of others.

(On motion of Senator Ataullahjan, debate adjourned.)

(At 3:15 p.m., the Senate was continued until tomorrow at 2 p.m.)