SoVote

Context: House Hansard - 218 - Jun/21/23

Jun/21/23 9:41:20 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, my colleague talked about a plan to return to balanced budgets. We agree that governments need to be able to plan ahead. It is only right for us to be able to see a plan. My colleague is worried about inflation. Pensioners on fixed incomes and seniors are struggling to make ends meet. Does he not think that instead of giving $20 billion in subsidies to oil companies that made $220 billion in profits in 2022, we should take some of that money and increase old age pensions and ensure that our seniors can live better?

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Mr. Marty Morantz

Jun/21/23 9:42:20 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, finally I hear another member of Parliament say it is a good idea to have a plan to balance the budget. I hope that the members of the Liberal Party are paying attention to the good common sense of the Bloc MP, the instruction of the IMF, and not just relying on how they view partisan interests of other members of Parliament.

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Ms. Lindsay Mathyssen (London—Fanshawe, NDP)

Jun/21/23 9:43:04 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, I actually really enjoyed the hon. member's speech, especially at the beginning when he talked about how incredible the NDP has been in balancing provincial budgets. It is because, at the time, the NDP ensured all people were paying their fair share, including CEOs and corporations. The share they paid was equal to what they owed. Considering the NDP's incredible record of good fiscal management, building a social safety net and ensuring there was balance while supporting people, I want to ask the hon. member this. Why will the Conservative Party not follow our lead and call on this government to implement a windfall tax on excess profits?

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Mr. Marty Morantz

Jun/21/23 9:43:54 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, only the NDP members could think that increasing taxes on Canadians will make life more affordable for Canadians. I do hope they pay attention to Mr. Doer's record, and come around and support our motion.

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Mr. Mike Morrice (Kitchener Centre, GP)

Jun/21/23 9:44:14 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, to be fair, the question was not on raising taxes on the average person but on the largest oil and gas companies in the country, which have made over $38 billion in profit this year alone. Is the hon. member not supportive of making sure that kind of money goes to support Canadians who need it most?

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Mr. Marty Morantz

Jun/21/23 9:44:37 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, again, only the NDP and obviously the Green Party could think that increasing taxes will make life more affordable for Canadians.

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Mr. Greg McLean (Calgary Centre, CPC)

Jun/21/23 9:44:53 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, I think I am the last speaker in this session of Parliament before we take a summer break, and it is my pleasure to be serving here for the constituents of Calgary Centre. I hope I have represented what I said I would represent in the House for them. If I have let them down in anything I have done or said in the House or anything I have done publicly, I apologize to them for that. I hope to represent them well on all these things, with the highest regard for this House. Let me take 10 minutes, and this will be as concise as I can make it, to talk about where we are going in the financial future of this country. We need to link here exactly what is happening with the government. It is about truth and consequences. The truth, of course, is that we are running bigger and bigger deficits. Our debt is getting higher and higher. There are consequences to this going forward, and those consequences are going to be borne not by the government in power here but by the Canadian people, who are going to continue to face mounting debts, deficits, interest payments and household debts going forward. Three months ago, we had a Liberal finance minister deliver a budget. In it, there was a lot that she put in front of Parliament, including another $40 billion-plus deficit added to Canada's debt, which has now reached $1.3 trillion. That is only federal government debt. Layer the provincial government debt on top of that, of all the combined provincial governments, and there is another $900 billion. We are talking about a society that, from a government perspective, is very much in debt. The government, in its fiscal wisdom, says that the provincial governments are starting to actually get more money. There is one provincial government that received money last year, and that was my home province of Alberta, because of a boom in oil prices that led to a whole bunch of royalties. This translated into over $21 billion being forwarded to various governments across Canada as a result of a prosperous industry. We need to make sure we understand what is happening here. This is an industry that suffered for a number of years before it actually made any profit. This is the economic basis of what is holding up the social welfare of this country at this point in time. I am going to go back to the finance minister's speech. There was federal debt and provincial debt, but she was also facing an inflation regime at that point in time that was around 4%. It had come down from last summer from about 8.2% to 4%. How did that happen? It happened because the Bank of Canada, an instrument of the Government of Canada, had raised interest rates from 0.25% to 4.5%. It had done its job in trying to control inflation. This is the mandate of the Bank of Canada. It performed that mandate, but it had to do so because of government overspending. The Bank of Canada did what it had to do to bring that rate back down. It came down to 4%. What happened in April? The consumer price index went back up. Inflation in Canada's economy went back up. Why did it go back up in April? It is because the government imposed a 30% increase on the carbon tax upon the backs of Canadians. Of course, that rippled all the way through the economy and caused inflation at the pumps, inflation at the food stores and inflation in everything we do that involves energy. There is something the government does not seem to have a hold on. If it increases the costs in the economy, it is going to increase inflation. It is doing this in two ways. It is increasing the costs to Canadians, and it is increasing deficits. These are all monetary mechanisms, fiscal mechanisms, that increase inflation. The government asked the Bank of Canada if it could come in and fix its mess from imposing more costs upon Canadians. When the minister delivered her budget, the Bank of Canada rate was 4.5%. That went up this month, on June 7, to 4.75%. What was declining in both respects has gone up. The cost of inflation has gone up, and the cost to Canadians has gone up again. They are all refinancing their mortgages, and it is another 0.25%. Where will this end? We do not know at this point in time. It is costing Canadians more and more. What is the principal cause of this inflation? The number one cause of inflation in the economy is money printing. The government continues to print money. It has doubled Canada's debt in eight years. The government is going to say that we had to do that to keep people safe during the pandemic. I say to my friends on the other side that the pandemic is over. We have to get back to some sort of balance, where we are actually paying for the goods we consume in society today with today's dollars. We keep taxing the future generation of Canadians to pay for our spending today, and that is something that has to change. That is something my party is asking the government to change, because it is a necessity for the future of this country. Now, I will talk about this recipe for inflation that the government has imposed upon this country at this point in time. It has asked the Bank of Canada to come in and fix our mistakes again and again. What is the consequence of the Bank of Canada coming in and raising the interest rates throughout the economy? It is having higher mortgage rates. This means that the actual cost of maintaining the mortgage on the same house has risen by 122% in the last eight years, which is significant. I will explain what the issue is. When mortgage rates are low, as they were up to a year ago, people buy houses. However, we have a saying in finance that we do not really buy the house that we need; rather, we buy the house the payment will afford. A 25-year mortgage at 0.25% with a $100,000 down payment, for instance, will equate to a bigger house than if the mortgage payment is around 4.75%-plus, which is what we have done to Canadians. We have added four and a half points of interest to mortgages, which is hundreds of thousands of dollars to the average Canadian. We have actually picked their pocket here, or pulled a bait and switch as to the house they can buy. The end result for many Canadians is that they are going to have to walk away from their house, because the equity in their house is not going to equal what it was when they bought the house. They are losing value in their house because of the current government. However, there is not enough housing in this country anyway. We have to get building again, and we have to make sure we get back to balance. We have to ensure that we serve Canadians to make sure that they have the ability to build a life in Canada going forward. Canada's GDP is $2.3 trillion at this point in time, and the consumer debt of Canadians equals 107% of that; therefore, it is over $2.3 trillion, and about 75% of that is mortgage debt. This is the most indebted ratio in the G7. We are more exposed to a downturn in the economy than any other economy in the world is at this point in time. This is on the cusp of danger. We call it moral hazard. The government has not faced the fact that, in supposedly good times, it is supposed to balance the budget, pay back some of the debt and bring down interest rates so that people can actually get the economy going. However, it continues to spend more money, ramp up the cost of everything and make sure that Canadians are bearing it on their backs. The back it is going to bear the most on is mortgage rates, which are going to push many Canadians out of their homes as the rates rise and Canadians have to refinance. That is the great tragedy we are visiting upon Canadians without balanced budgets. My party has actually been pushing the government for a long time to show us a plan where it gets back to balance, because in every budget it has shown us so far, it says, “Well, you know, we are going to continue to spend more and more.” A $10-billion temporary budget deficit in 2016 has turned into hundreds of billions of dollars per year. There is another $40 billion-plus this year and more of that going down the road. This is to say nothing of the debt service charge, which has doubled in the last two years. We are up to $44 billion that we are going to have to pay as interest. All of this is contributing to inflation. We have to get back on track. I will tell the government to please bring us a plan so Canadians can see that they will actually get back on track.

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Ms. Leah Taylor Roy (Aurora—Oak Ridges—Richmond Hill, Lib.)

Jun/21/23 9:54:31 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, through you, I would like to ask the member opposite some questions. First, I thank him for that very fact-filled discourse. He spoke authoritatively on a number of fronts, and I would just like to check some of those facts. He started off by saying that we were running bigger and bigger deficits every year. In 2021, the deficit was $328 billion; in 2022, it was $90 billion; and it is projected to be $40 billion this year. Could he reconcile his statement with these facts? Second, he said that we do not know where this is all going to end, and it is true, we do not; the future is always uncertain. However, the Bank of Canada expects inflation to come down below 3% by the end of the summer and interest rates to follow in decline. Third, he said that printing money was the cause of inflation. I understand that this is one economic theory, and it is the economic theory that the Conservatives follow. However, many economists have said that, in fact, the war in Ukraine and the COVID pandemic have been the causes of inflation worldwide. Could you comment on a few of those apparent contradictions to what you said?

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The Speaker

Jun/21/23 9:55:42 p.m.
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I would remind hon. members that when they ask questions or make comments, they should do it through the Chair and not directly to each other. It makes things run a little more smoothly. The hon. member for Calgary Centre.

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Mr. Greg McLean

Jun/21/23 9:55:54 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, I have been corrected. The member is correct that there were larger deficits during the pandemic than there were after the pandemic. Every year, we look at the deficit the Liberals put on the table for the next year, and it always rises. This is the point I was trying to make, and if I misspoke in that respect, I owe her an apology. There were three questions, but the member talked about economists, Conservative theories and all this stuff. These are not Conservative theories; these are economic theories. I know that, sooner or later, the Liberals will have to start paying attention to economics and finance. The numbers will actually matter at the end of the day. I apologize to the member because I have forgotten her second question out of the three. If she could ask me again later, I would appreciate it.

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Ms. Monique Pauzé (Repentigny, BQ)

Jun/21/23 9:56:54 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, the Conservative Party stated in its motion what is wrong, and I think it has a good read on the situation. The problem is the solutions it proposes, because it seems to think they would magically solve all the problems. I want to talk about one problem in particular, and that is the price of oil. History has shown us that the biggest factor in price fluctuations is the price of oil, over which we have no control. It is a global price. It depends on wars, like the war in Ukraine. It depends on the Organization of the Petroleum Exporting Countries, which just said it is going to reduce output. It depends on all sorts of things. Does the member not think that the best way to stabilize prices would be to end our dependence on oil as soon as possible?

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Mr. Greg McLean

Jun/21/23 9:57:50 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, the theory that there is no more need for oil is very interesting. The world uses a lot of energy, and over 80% of it comes from fossil fuels. I am sure that Canada's oil companies do not have much say over the price of oil. That is determined by global markets, which set world oil prices. The prices of other forms of energy also depend on the price of oil.

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Mr. Gord Johns (Courtenay—Alberni, NDP)

Jun/21/23 9:58:47 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, we keep hearing from the Conservatives about their corporate and free market-driven housing policies. Nowhere in the world has the free market solved an affordable housing crisis. We even heard from the member that his own city council rejected the Conservative Party's Ottawa-knows-best proposals. Will the Conservatives get on board with building non-market housing to solve the housing crisis to ensure that people have affordable, safe and secure housing in the long term?

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Mr. Greg McLean

Jun/21/23 9:59:26 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, I do not know where my colleague got that fact about the city council in Calgary and Conservative policy, because we are all about building affordable houses. I will point out to the member that there was a solution before there was a problem. There was not a housing crisis for either affordable housing or housing for Canadians who had the money to buy houses eight years ago. How did this problem arise? Let me figure it out. What happened eight years ago? I will ask my colleague who asked that question why he is supporting a government that has created the problem that Conservatives need to get in power to solve.

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The Speaker

Jun/21/23 10:00:00 p.m.
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The hon. member for New Westminster—Burnaby is rising on a point of order.

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Mr. Peter Julian (New Westminster—Burnaby, NDP)

Jun/21/23 10:00:07 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, since we have already passed the motion to adjourn the House this evening, on behalf of our leader, the member for Burnaby South, and the entire NDP caucus, I would like to take a few moments to praise the people who work here in the House. These people make our democracy work. I am talking about the pages, who do an exemplary job—

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The Speaker

Jun/21/23 10:00:50 p.m.
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That is very kind of the hon. member, but it is not really a point of order. It sounds more like a speech. I will give the hon. member another chance. If it has something to do with the Standing Orders, I will let him continue.

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Mr. Peter Julian

Jun/21/23 10:01:07 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, there is a tradition at the end of the session that each of the parties takes a moment to thank the people who really make our democracy work, so I would ask you for unanimous consent for two minutes to do that on behalf of the NDP.

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All Topics

The Speaker

Jun/21/23 10:01:26 p.m.
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Does the member have unanimous consent to move the motion? An hon. member: Nay.

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Mr. Chris Bittle (Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Canadian Heritage, Lib.)

Jun/21/23 10:01:41 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, I rise on a point of order. While I am on my feet and before I get to the point of order, I want to thank all staff and all hon. members and wish them a very happy summer, including the Minister of Seniors and the member for Kingston and the Islands. I believe you have received advance notice, and if you seek it, I believe you will find unanimous consent for the following motion. I move: That, notwithstanding Standing Order 28 or any other usual practice of the House, the following proposed calendar for the year 2024 be tabled and that the House adopt this calendar.

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