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Ms. Jenny Kwan (Vancouver East, NDP)

Feb/7/23 3:12:09 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, indigenous peoples are overrepresented in the homeless population. The Parliamentary Budget Officer said that it would require $27.5 billion to close this housing gap. The Liberals' allocation of $300 million over five years is a drop in the bucket. While the NDP forced the Liberals to roll this out over two years for urgent need, more needs to be done. The National Urban, Rural, and Northern Indigenous Housing Coalition is calling on the government to commit $6 billion in budget 2023. The NDP fully supports this. Will the Liberals make this commitment to help end the housing crisis for indigenous peoples?

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Hon. Ahmed Hussen (Minister of Housing and Diversity and Inclusion, Lib.)

Feb/7/23 3:12:51 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, we are fully committed to working with indigenous people to co-develop an urban, rural and northern indigenous housing strategy. Through budget 2022, we are investing over $4 billion in indigenous housing through co-developing processes, including for the urban, rural and northern indigenous housing strategy. Some of that work is already under way. More than 41% of all the units delivered under the rapid housing initiative are going up in indigenous communities, not only because the need is there, but also because indigenous communities are stepping up and leveraging federal dollars to build rapid housing for their communities.

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Ms. Rachel Blaney (North Island—Powell River, NDP)

Feb/7/23 3:13:27 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, too many seniors in Canada are in serious poverty. Last week, I moved a motion to apply equal OAS payments to all seniors, regardless of age. Sadly, the government voted against it. My office was contacted by a senior who is now making a human rights complaint against Service Canada. Why? It is because this government is participating in discrimination based on age. When will the minister finally admit that she is allowing some seniors to fall below the poverty line and lifting others? She needs to do it. It is time.

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Hon. Kamal Khera (Minister of Seniors, Lib.)

Feb/7/23 3:14:12 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, we recognize the challenges seniors are facing. That is precisely why we have been there for them every single step of the way. That is why we doubled the GST credit for six months. That is why we have increased the guaranteed income supplement, which has helped over 900,000 seniors and has lifted 45,000 seniors out of poverty. That is exactly why we increased the old age security by 10% last year, and that is why we are, of course, enhancing the CPP. On this side of the House, we are going to continue to support all Canadians, including seniors.

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The Speaker

Feb/7/23 3:14:42 p.m.
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I wish to draw the attention of members to the presence in the gallery of the Hon. Mickey Amery, Minister of Children’s Services for the Province of Alberta. Some hon. members: Hear, hear!

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The Speaker

Feb/7/23 3:15:12 p.m.
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Pursuant to order made on Thursday, June 23, the House will now proceed to the taking of the deferred recorded division on the motion to concur in the fifth report of the Standing Committee on Government Operations and Estimates. Call in the members.

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The Speaker

Feb/7/23 3:27:50 p.m.
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I declare the motion carried. I wish to inform the House that, because of the deferred recorded division, Government Orders will be extended by 11 minutes.

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Mr. Mark Gerretsen (Parliamentary Secretary to the Leader of the Government in the House of Commons (Senate), Lib.)

Feb/7/23 3:28:55 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, as I was saying prior to the start of question period, it is unfortunate that we continue to see the same motion coming from the Conservative Party. It is pretty clear how the rest of the House, every other non-Conservative member, feels about this issue. This is extremely problematic, in my view. All 338 Conservative candidates and every Conservative member who was elected in the 2021 election ran on a platform of pricing pollution. The Leader of the Opposition, the member for Carleton, ran on pricing pollution. Now, suddenly, the Conservatives have done a complete 180° and are trying to suggest that it is not the way forward. I could understand if they changed their minds. One of them could stand up and say, “Yes, we changed our minds; this is our new plan”, but none of them will do that. They are completely ignoring this, and they will not explain why they are taking a different position now. More importantly, after 150 days of his leadership, we are anxiously waiting to hear the alternative plan to be presented by the Leader of the Opposition to Canadians should the unfortunate scenario occur that he be elected as prime minister. In any event, I hope we will finally see the end of these frivolous motions that keep coming forward from the Conservatives. We are now on the seventh one. Hopefully, the next time they have an opposition day, they will find something that better contributes to genuine solutions and compromise to make the lives of Canadians better.

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Mr. Kyle Seeback (Dufferin—Caledon, CPC)

Feb/7/23 3:30:46 p.m.
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Mr. Speaker, the member and all members of the government waxed poetically about how wonderful the carbon tax is and how it is saving the planet. If it is so effective and so fantastic, why has the government never met a single emissions-reduction target despite bringing in the carbon tax? Why have carbon emissions gone up under the Liberals every single year they have been in government except in the year of the pandemic, when everything was shut down?

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Mr. Mark Gerretsen

Feb/7/23 3:31:23 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, I have answered this question several times in the past. When the member was asking a question prior to question period, he specifically brought up the PBO's report, and I referenced his question on that later on. If they are looking at how one element of something will impact the economy and society without considering all the other variables and inputs that go into it, they can draw pretty much any conclusion they want. When I look at things holistically, either I can take up the anecdotal comments from the Conservative Party about pricing pollution or I can listen to the 99% of economists throughout the globe who say that putting a price on something will change and incentivize behaviour and habits in the marketplace. Forgive me if I do not listen to the Conservatives' rhetoric on this. I would rather listen to the experts.

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Mr. Mike Morrice (Kitchener Centre, GP)

Feb/7/23 3:32:28 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, I want to start by noting that the member for Kingston and the Islands was the only member of the governing party who supported an opposition motion calling for the end of subsidies to the oil and gas sector just a few months ago, which included the false climate solution of carbon capture and storage. His voice on this is one of the most credible in the House. I wonder if he can share more about the importance of ending all subsidies to the oil and gas sector.

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Mr. Mark Gerretsen

Feb/7/23 3:32:59 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, I certainly appreciate the compliment from the member for Kitchener Centre. We do have the luxury of being able to voice our individual opinions on this side of the House, so in my personal opinion, I do not support subsidizing the fossil fuel industry. I do not think it is a thing that governments throughout Canada or developed countries throughout the world should be participating in. There is more than enough profit to go around in the fossil fuel industry, and I personally do not support it. I exercised that belief through the vote the member referenced, but I also respect the fact that other people have different opinions on this. I will continue, both internally and externally, to voice my opinions and my concerns on various issues.

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Mr. John Williamson (New Brunswick Southwest, CPC)

Feb/7/23 3:33:54 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, the member likes to talk about promises made and broken promises, of which there have been numerous on the Liberal side. However, one that I keep referencing and hearing about is the Liberal promise to never, cross their hearts and hope to die, increase the carbon tax beyond $50 a tonne. Every single Liberal ran on that promise and the Liberals have voted to increase the carbon tax to $170 a tonne. Why the double-talk?

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Mr. Mark Gerretsen

Feb/7/23 3:34:30 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, I hope the member appreciates that I will directly answer his question. I will not try to avoid answering it, as the Conservatives do every time I ask a question about changing their position on their platform. At the time, I thought that was the right solution and now I do not. I realized that pricing something actually impacts choice in the marketplace, and I have changed my mind on it. Do members see how easy that was? When someone changes their mind on something, as the Conservatives clearly did since the last election, it is okay to get up and talk about it and explain to people that they once had one position on something and now have a different position on it. I would encourage the Conservatives to recognize my ability to do that, and I would encourage them to do the same thing as it relates to their platform commitment in the last election to put a price on pollution.

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Mr. Kyle Seeback (Dufferin—Caledon, CPC)

Feb/7/23 3:35:32 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, if we want to talk about some numbers, I will start with this number: 415%. The Orangeville Food Bank, which is in my riding of Dufferin—Caledon, has just put out information saying that the number of seniors accessing the food bank in Orangeville has gone up 415%. That is the result of eight years of the Liberal government. The Liberals will say that we should stop talking about how expensive things are and stop talking about how difficult things are for Canadians; everything is great. Well, everything is not great after eight years of the Liberal government. Forty-five per cent of Canadians are within $200 of not being able to make ends meet. That is another inconvenient number for the government, but it is also the result of eight years of the current Liberal government. Then we get to the question of why we are here. Why do so many seniors have to go to the food bank? Why are so many households within $200 of not being able to make ends meet? It is because life has gotten so much more expensive under the Liberal government. Why has that happened? I will today look at one thing. I will talk about the carbon tax. The carbon tax is the mother of taxes because it is put on everything. We have heard today many Conservative members talk about the effect the carbon tax has on agriculture. My riding is a proud agricultural producer. It is the number one driver of economic activity, and guess what. The carbon tax is punishing farmers. The government will say erroneously that eight out of 10 Canadians will get more money back from the carbon tax than they pay in. I will deal with that a little later in this speech, because it is quite frankly not true. In the context of farming and agriculture, there are farmers who get carbon tax bills for drying grain and doing other things on the farm that add up to somewhere in the neighbourhood of $30,000 to $40,000 per year. What is their rebate? It is $800. They are not getting more money back than they pay into the carbon tax. Farmers from coast to coast to coast are being absolutely crushed by the Liberal carbon tax. We could say that it is their problem, but let us think about what that actually means. When a carbon tax of $40,000 is put on an agricultural producer, they have to pass on the cost of it. They cannot just absorb it and go bankrupt. What does that mean? It means that when families go to the grocery store, everything is more expensive, and it is a lot more expensive. Maybe when there is a 415% increase in the number of seniors going to the food bank, there might be a connection. Food is getting much more expensive because of the carbon tax, and seniors are going to a food bank. Forty-five per cent of Canadians are within $200 of not being to make ends meet. Why is that? It is because everything is more expensive. Their food is more expensive because producers are paying this gigantic carbon tax. It does not end there. Yes, producers are paying the carbon tax, but the carbon tax is also put on the vehicles that get driven. I neglected to say that I am splitting my time with the member for Louis-Saint-Laurent. When we are taking a crop by truck from a farm to where it will ultimately be consumed, it is going to be subject to a carbon tax. At the grocery store where that food is, someone will have to heat the grocery store. The heating is subject to the carbon tax, so the store increases prices. All along the line and all along the food chain, everyone is charging more. What does that mean? It means the farmer charges more, the transport company charges more and the grocery store charges more. It also means everyone is paying much more for the basic necessity of eating. When one talks about heating one's home, it is the same thing. Many constituents come to me and say, “Look at this bill. Look at the carbon tax on my bill. I cannot afford it.” The government tells them to stop. It says that it is giving them some money, so they are going to be better off. Of course, I will get back to that. They are not better off. If they were better off, 45% of Canadians would not be within $200 of failing to make ends meet. If the carbon tax is so wonderful, as the government says, and if it pours so much money back into the pockets of Canadians, why do we have statistics like this? The rhetoric does not actually meet with reality. Let us talk about the effect of the carbon tax on trade. I will go back to agricultural products. Canada is a proud exporting nation. Over 60% of our GDP is from exports. Agriculture is a huge part of that. When we make our farmers incur $30,000 or $40,000 in carbon tax, guess what? Their agricultural products are more expensive. It is harder for them to access foreign markets. What does that mean? Less profit comes back to Canadian farmers. Then, they cannot invest in new machinery, new equipment and everything else. The carbon tax is a tax on life. It is making life unaffordable for Canadians across the entire economic spectrum. Only a Liberal government would say that it is going to take dollars through the carbon tax and give back dimes and that we should be grateful, that we are better off. That is the message to Canadians every single day, that they should be so lucky. If the carbon tax were actually doing something, one might be able to justify the senior going to the food bank or the family with the thermostat down to 17°C in the winter. One could say that it was actually doing something, but guess what? It is actually not. Under the Liberal government, carbon emissions have gone up every year. It will say, no, they went down in 2020. Yes they did go down during the pandemic, when the economy was shut down. If that is the plan, the government should be honest with Canadians. If it wants emissions to go down by 9% and it is therefore going to have the economy contract by 5%, just stand up and let Canadians know so that they can decide how they want to vote in the next election. It is causing enormous pain in this country. It is causing inflation. Even the Bank of Canada has admitted that the carbon tax is inflationary. We have an inflation problem in the country, but they will keep saying that we are against the carbon tax, that we do not care about the environment and that we do not care about climate change. Actually, they are the ones who do not seem to care, because the carbon tax is doing nothing to reduce Canadian carbon emissions. On that very simple formula of whether it reduces emissions, the unequivocal answer is no, it does not. It is an absolute failure. Let us turn to the final piece of the puzzle. They will say that eight out of 10 Canadians are better off. They get more money as a result of the carbon tax than they pay into it. There was a report that said that. However, then the PBO did another report called “A Distributional Analysis of Federal Carbon Pricing under A Healthy Environment and A Healthy Economy”. It showed that when we factor in the effects of the carbon tax across the economy, which I was just talking about, it makes everything more expensive and leads to unemployment. Most Canadian families lose. It is like saying that I have an A in science because I got an A on the mid-term and an F on the final. That is effectively what they are saying. The first report is irrelevant because the PBO dug deeper. I know it is hard. I mean, it is 20 pages, so they might not have the intestinal fortitude to read it. Pages 18 to 20 make it abundantly clear that the carbon tax is hurting Canadians. Why will they not scrap it?

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Mr. Kevin Lamoureux (Parliamentary Secretary to the Leader of the Government in the House of Commons, Lib.)

Feb/7/23 3:45:21 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, decades ago, Alberta was one of the first governments in North America to implement the principles of a price on pollution. We had individuals like Stephen Harper who supports the principles of a price on pollution. We have 338 Conservative candidates in the last federal election who campaigned on the principles of a price on pollution. A brand new, shiny leader, who is losing his shine awfully quickly, took ownership of the Conservative Party. Now they have taken a major twist that has turned into a flip-flop. Why and how does the Conservative Party today justify rejecting the principles of a price on pollution when every other administration throughout the world seems to be adopting it?

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Mr. Kyle Seeback

Feb/7/23 3:46:13 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, the carbon tax is punitive. That is why we want to scrap it. People living in a rural area, heating their homes with propane and driving long distances to work are getting absolutely demolished by the carbon tax, and the Liberals will wax on, saying, “So what?” The carbon tax is designed to hurt rural Canadians, and it does. That is why we want to scrap it. It is an awful carbon tax. The Liberals should be embarrassed to keep propping it up. They should be taking responsibility for what they are doing to Canadian families and the affordability crisis. The carbon tax is one thing they could do to fix it, but they are so stubborn and ideological that they will not.

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Mr. Luc Desilets (Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, BQ)

Feb/7/23 3:47:03 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, UN Secretary-General Antonio Guterres denounced the corporate greed of oil and gas companies, saying they are making outrageous profits on the backs of the poor. ExxonMobil amassed a $74‑billion net profit. Why are the Conservatives not proposing a tax on these enormously excessive profits?

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Mr. Kyle Seeback

Feb/7/23 3:47:34 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, the member seems to not understand that oil and gas companies pay enormous amounts of taxes and they fund social programs and other things across the country. Is the member saying that when they have a good year we should tax them more? Is he saying that in a bad year the government should be paying those companies some money? If those companies have a good year, they pay a lot of taxes. If they have a bad year, they do not. That is how the system works. If he does not like it, maybe he should come up with a better system.

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Ms. Lori Idlout (Nunavut, NDP)

Feb/7/23 3:48:11 p.m.
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Uqaqtittiji, if this is really about tax fairness, why do the Conservatives not agree to tax the ultrarich, like Loblaws, which has profited millions while Canadians are struggling to pay for groceries?

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