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Dec/9/22 12:53:11 p.m.
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Re: Bill C-9

Madam Speaker, let me start by saying that I respect the work the member for Saint-Jean does in this chamber. She is a very diligent and thoughtful member of Parliament, and I respect her contributions. I will extend my same caution: Whenever we talk about the impartiality of judges, we need to keep our focus on the system and not on the individual judges. We inadvertently do damage, both to the judiciary as a whole and potentially to individual judges, when we talk about the appointment process in individual terms. I agree with her that we have to be able to question that process, but I urge us to keep our focus on that process. As for the appeal and the fact that the Bloc did not support my amendment to make it to the Federal Court of Appeal, I would just say again that the Supreme Court is likely never going to hear an appeal regarding a judge's disciplinary complaint, because of the very high standard it has set for leave to appeal to the court.

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Ms. Heather McPherson (Edmonton Strathcona, NDP)

Dec/9/22 12:54:19 p.m.
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Re: Bill C-9

Madam Speaker, I would like to thank my colleague. Every time he stands in this place and speaks on his knowledge about the justice system in this country, I learn something. I am grateful for the work he has done and for his thoughtful interventions in the House. Today he spoke about the fact that the bill could have been brought forward sooner, that there is cross-party support, and that there are still some flaws in it, but that it is, by and large, a good bill. He also spoke about the importance of diversity in the appointments of judges and the work that has been done in that area. I have been hearing some worrying concerns about the diversity of appointments in Alberta, my home province. Can he speak about how we could improve that system even further? How can we ensure the system is appropriate across the country?

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Mr. Randall Garrison

Dec/9/22 12:55:16 p.m.
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Re: Bill C-9

Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. member for Edmonton Strathcona for her question, because it is a serious concern. Unfortunately, what happens in our systems is that the funnel starts removing diversity very early. If a person is ever going to be a judge, they have to go to law school. The ability of various communities to get their kids into law school is highly differentiated. Certainly we are talking about Black Canadians and indigenous Canadians. The number of people who are represented at the law school level is far below what it should be. We start narrowing the funnel at law school. Then someone has to practise law for 10 years. We have a time factor. Even if we improve the diversity in law schools, which we are doing, it is going to be a 10-year time lag before someone is eligible for an appointment to the federal judiciary. That funnel is narrow, and it takes time. I do not know the details of Alberta. Being a British Columbia MP, I have not looked at the appointments in Alberta, but I am hopeful that the initiatives of both law societies and law schools to get more women and people of colour into law school and into the profession will eventually produce a more diverse judiciary.

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Mr. Arnold Viersen (Peace River—Westlock, CPC)

Dec/9/22 12:56:40 p.m.
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Re: Bill C-9

Madam Speaker, it is my honour to speak to Bill C-9 today. I know this is always an interesting topic, and I have spoken to it at the other stages along the way. I commend the Liberals for taking on the issue of judge accountability. It seems like an interesting topic for me, given the fact that Conservatives are often critical of the decisions made by judges across Canada. We find their leniency to be annoying. We find the overturning of the mandatory minimum sentencing to be frustrating, and all of those kinds of things, therefore we think there needs to be accountability for judges along the way. Then there is the issue of comments made by judges in public. We have seen that become an issue. There are also the actions judges may take in their personal lives that are beyond the pale. It is frustrating to the public that folks in a position of authority and a position of stature in our society would behave in such a manner. These are all areas in which we need to have a level of accountability. The member for Esquimalt—Saanich—Sooke talked about the independence of the judiciary. That is an important principle, and the bill would maintain that, for sure. The bill does a good job around personal behaviour accountability and accountability for comments made by judges outside of their role. It would not necessarily deal with accountability in terms of making judgments and things like that, so I would suggest perhaps there is an opportunity to go forward from here. We will be supporting the bill. It is a good first step. We have heard from folks across the country around the appeals process. Conservatives put forward recommendations to not make the Supreme Court the final appeal process, but to make the Federal Court of Appeals the final appeal process, and I would have supported that as well. Ensuring accountability for judgments is an interesting and more complicated area. For as long as I have been here I have been trying to come up with a solution for not only maintaining the independence of the judiciary but also having some sort of accountability for judgments made that are not in line with what the Canadian public agrees with. We have seen this very recently around sexual assault and people who are intoxicated. We have seen horrendous judgments from judges in that respect. I understand there is the notwithstanding clause here, so that Parliament can pass legislation to clarify a judgment. However, we have seen how the Liberal government has been loath to use the notwithstanding clause and has condemned other governments for using it. The notwithstanding clause is an extreme measure, and it also comes with a five-year renewal process. I do not think that is necessarily a good process. One of the more fascinating items that has come to my attention, and I throw this out there as more of a possibility, is around judge selection by having a panel of judges put forward. As I understand it, cases are generally assigned to particular judges along the way by a chief justice of sorts. There are jurisdictional regions from which cases come that are assigned to particular judges. There might be an opportunity for the movement of culture within the decisions that are made by judges to put forward a panel of judges rather than one particular judge. Similar to jury selection, both the prosecution and the defence would then agree upon a particular judge. If three judges were put forward in a particular case, out of the three, the prosecution and the defence would have to agree on a particular judge. That may in fact be the free market of judges, so to speak, a selection process that would ensure judges' accountability. Judges who were making poor judgments would not get as many cases, therefore it would be a kind of corrective action. I am not a lawyer. I am an auto mechanic, so there may be huge holes in this argument, but it seems to me that it is one way of providing judge accountability without going after the independence of the judiciary. If this place deals with judges and their inaction or their overturning of laws, because there is an interface there, that would be problematic. Putting politics into the judiciary would also be problematic. We want an independent judiciary, and that is very important. I want to reinforce that. I just put forward the idea around the panel of judges and the judge selection process as a possible opportunity for another mechanism for judge accountability. I am now going to turn my focus to more broader justice issues in this country. We saw the lowering of sentencing across the board in Bill C-71 and now in Bill C-5. We see how the removal or reduction of sentencing has led to an increase in violent crime across the country. Folks come to me often about rural crime in their communities and how that seems to be on the increase. Some of it is not so much to do with the laws. The laws have not changed a great deal over the last seven years, but the attitude has. That is really what frustrates me about the Liberals. The Liberals' lack of emphasis on justice and their emphasis on the rehabilitation of the criminal but not on aid to the victims or survivors are the kinds of things that have really frustrated me. There is also the lack of taking seriously the crimes that happen in our communities. I totally understand that there is a host of things, from our prison system to our justice system to our laws, that come into play. Then there is the administration of all of it. When people feel that the system will work, that their cases will be heard, that justice will be had and, if they are victims of crime, that the person will be taken out of their communities or their property will be returned to them, then there is an appetite to participate. If none of that is seen to be happening, there is an increasing issue of people not being interested in participating in the justice system. That goes in either of two directions. It goes to desperation in terms of not feeling like their country cares for them, but it also goes to vigilantism, where people take things into their own hands. The Liberals have completely failed in the administration of justice. It is mostly an attitudinal thing. It is not about the particular laws or the system. It is a lot about where they place their emphasis. We have seen, since the Liberals have taken power, that rural crime and violent crime across this country have been on an upward trajectory. That is because victims do not feel that they will get restitution for the problems they are facing. Criminals do not feel they will be held accountable either. Constituents contacted me about some pickup truck rolling into their yard. They went outside and there were people stealing scrap metal or copper right out of their yard. They confronted them, and the criminals said to call the police and asked what they were going to do about it. That is exactly what is happening in our communities. It comes from the tacit support for the movement to defund the police, from the lowering of sentencing across the board and from the lack of concern for the victim. It is not a funding issue. We hear the Liberals saying all the time that they have more funding for all of those issues. It is not the funding that is the issue. It is the attitude. We see it over and over again. The case in point is probably the border security issue that is tangentially attached to this. Under the Conservatives, we spent a lot less on border security. We also did not have a big problem with people coming across the border illegally. People understood that if they came across the border illegally, we were turning them right back around. When the Conservatives were in government, that was the case. That is my major frustration. Last, I will talk a little about the firearms situation in Canada. The Liberal government has let the veil slip. It has been trying to ban, confiscate, make illegal and criminalize firearm ownership in this country, full stop. The Liberals always deny that. They always say they are not doing that. However, they have now let veil slip and have put in an amendment to Bill C-21 that includes hundreds of hunting rifles. They were caught, and now they are saying they did not mean to and did not understand. The Liberals are the ones who say they know how to define firearms. They are the ones telling us they have the experts on their side. They are the ones who said they paid for all the studies. If they have done all of that hard work, how come hunting rifles are ending up on the list? They are ending up on the list because the Liberals have let the veil slip. They have been after everyone's firearms, not just the handguns, which we were fine with. We said that if they were going to do this, they were going to do this. We do not think criminals should have firearms. However, when it comes to hunting rifles and farmers having the tools of their jobs, that is where we have drawn the line. We now know what the Liberals' plans are when it comes to firearm ownership in this country. They want to ban it. They want to criminalize it. They want to confiscate the firearms of everyday Canadians. That is extremely worrying. This particular bill is about judge accountability, and I commend the Liberals for it. I did not think they had it in them to bring forward a bill on judge accountability. I am happy they have. I think judge accountability is something we need to ensure continues in Canada. I have put forward another mechanism for judge accountability, and I am looking forward to having more discussions on that as well. However, I am concerned that the issues this country faces around justice and law and order do not come from the particular laws and systems that we have in this place, but from the soft-on-crime attitudes of the Liberals and their lack of concern for public safety. This has caused a dramatic decrease in the safety of everyday Canadians, with the running wild, the unaccountability and the lack of fear that we see from criminals in this country as they operate on the streets of Canada. That is what I hear more and more from Canadians across the country. Criminals operate with impunity. People ask me about this all the time. Why do these criminals operate in broad daylight? Do they not fear the police? They do not. We hear from Canadians over and over again that these criminals fear nothing in Canada. They do not fear the judicial system. They do not fear our police. We need to ensure that our police forces have the political backing to do what they need to do to take these guys off our streets. We have to make sure that the justice system takes these criminals off the streets and puts them away for a long time to ensure that our streets are safe. If we do not have safety in our communities, we do not have anything. That is the reality. Safety and security are the fundamental building blocks of a stable and strong country, and we must maintain that as we watch other things fall apart in this country. That starts with the justice, law and order issues in this country, not to mention the inflation issues, the border security issues and the inability to get a passport. There is a whole host of other things that are falling apart. We need to ensure that our justice system works and that we feel safe to walk around the streets of Canada. Therefore, I will be supporting this bill, and I look forward to questions and comments.

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Mrs. Stephanie Kusie (Calgary Midnapore, CPC)

Dec/9/22 1:12:08 p.m.
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Re: Bill C-9

Madam Speaker, I certainly know the member has done incredible work on human trafficking. I was hoping he could share more of his insights and experience regarding the incredible work he has done with respect to the content of the bill.

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Mr. Arnold Viersen

Dec/9/22 1:12:29 p.m.
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Re: Bill C-9

Madam Speaker, with respect to the fight against human trafficking here in Canada, I am working hard to have Canada declare zero tolerance for human trafficking. I know that in Canada we have a national strategy to end human trafficking and modern-day slavery, which was put in place by a Conservative government back in 2012. It was not funded from 2016 to 2019. The Liberals have re-funded it now. I have a bill that I just put on the Order Paper, Bill C-308, which would mandate a national strategy to end human trafficking from now into the future. It would also require the Minister of Public Safety to issue an annual report on what the government is doing to fight human trafficking with measurable deliverables.

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Mr. Jean-Denis Garon (Mirabel, BQ)

Dec/9/22 1:13:29 p.m.
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Re: Bill C-9

Madam Speaker, a man died recently on Mirabel airport property after Aéroports de Montréal prohibited its firefighters from responding to a fire. I wonder if my colleague is comfortable with the fact that today we are reviewing legislation dealing with sanctions for judges and calling for more accountability for the judiciary, while non-profit organizations like Aéroports de Montréal, which act like a state within a state, which lack transparency, which endanger the lives of the public and the health and safety of their employees, are in no way accountable to taxpayers, to Quebeckers and Canadians. Am I the only one here who finds this is abhorrent and thinks there should be more accountability in many other areas, including Aéroports de Montréal?

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Mr. Arnold Viersen

Dec/9/22 1:14:22 p.m.
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Re: Bill C-9

Madam Speaker, the accountability of the Montreal airport authority is something I know very little about. That sounds terrible. I am generally in favour of less government and more democracy. That would be my take on this. I am not really familiar with the specifics of what the member is talking about, but what I can say is, I think this bill is a good first step with respect to the accountability of judges. However, I have put forward some other recommendations on judge accountability, and I look forward to having discussions about that as well.

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Mr. Michael Cooper (St. Albert—Edmonton, CPC)

Dec/9/22 1:15:03 p.m.
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Re: Bill C-9

Madam Speaker, in Bill C-9, there is a strengthened review process where allegations are made against judges regarding sexual misconduct. That is a good thing, but this is the same government that just passed a bill, Bill C-5, to allow criminals convicted of sexual assault to be able to serve their sentences at home, perhaps next door or down the street from their victims. What does that say about the current government's priorities?

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Mr. Arnold Viersen

Dec/9/22 1:15:41 p.m.
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Re: Bill C-9

Madam Speaker, that was precisely the point of my entire speech, that the attitude of the Liberal government around crime is causing an increase in crime across this country. Bill C-5, which the member mentioned, also allows human traffickers to be placed under house arrest rather than spend their time in jail. Many human traffickers are able to control their victims from inside prison, never mind when they are inside the very same community they were operating in before. Many of them operate from their homes and are able to control their victims through a multitude of means. Not taking these people out of society to do their time and rehabilitate them is a complete failure of justice and leads to the reasons why Canadians do not report crime when they see it and why criminals feel that they can operate with impunity.

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Mrs. Stephanie Kusie

Dec/9/22 1:16:50 p.m.
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Re: Bill C-9

Madam Speaker, I was very bothered recently to see, in the city of Calgary, that the Louise Dean school for pregnant teenagers is being shut down and moved to another school in a different location. I know that the member has taken an interest in this issue as well and has done some local advocacy on this issue. I was hoping that he might give his thoughts on the decision by the CBE school board to move these women from an environment that is more supportive to their situation as individuals to a less safe and less supportive situation.

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Mr. Arnold Viersen

Dec/9/22 1:17:37 p.m.
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Re: Bill C-9

Madam Speaker, the Louise Dean school has been a gem in Alberta for a very long time. It has helped thousands of women who have found themselves to be pregnant while still in high school. This school has a long track record. It is widely loved by the community. The decision to shut that particular school down is atrocious, and I certainly hope that the decision will be reversed. I know that the member for Calgary Midnapore has a unique relationship with that school as well. I look forward to hearing from people from across the country who are concerned about this kind of action being taken by the Calgary school board.

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The Assistant Deputy Speaker (Mrs. Alexandra Mendès)

Dec/9/22 1:18:20 p.m.
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Re: Bill C-9

Is the House ready for the question? Some hon. members: Question. The Assistant Deputy Speaker (Mrs. Alexandra Mendès): The vote is on the motion.

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The Assistant Deputy Speaker (Mrs. Alexandra Mendès)

Dec/9/22 1:19:07 p.m.
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The hon. deputy House leader.

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Deputy

Mrs. Sherry Romanado

Dec/9/22 1:19:15 p.m.
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Madam Speaker, I think that if you canvass the House, I am sure that you will find consent to see the clock at 1:30 p.m.

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The Assistant Deputy Speaker (Mrs. Alexandra Mendès)

Dec/9/22 1:19:23 p.m.
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Is it agreed? Some hon. members: Agreed. The Assistant Deputy Speaker (Mrs. Alexandra Mendès): It being 1:30 p.m., the House will now proceed to the consideration of Private Members' Business as listed on today's Order Paper.

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Mrs. Jenica Atwin (Fredericton, Lib.)

Dec/9/22 1:20:00 p.m.
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Re: Bill S-219

moved that Bill S‑219, An Act respecting a National Ribbon Skirt Day, be concurred in.

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The Assistant Deputy Speaker (Mrs. Alexandra Mendès)

Dec/9/22 1:20:00 p.m.
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There being no amendment motions at report stage, the House will now proceed, without debate, to the putting of the question on the motion to concur in the bill at report stage.

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Mrs. Jenica Atwin

Dec/9/22 1:21:05 p.m.
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Re: Bill S-219

moved that Bill S-219, be read the third time and passed. She said: Madam Speaker, as always, I want to first begin by acknowledging that I am addressing the House from the unceded territory of the Anishinabe people. At the core of the beliefs of the Anishinabe is a notion of respect. Each element is part of the cycle of life. Each has its purpose and deserves as much respect. Our relationships are what matter the most, and we should cherish them. I have the immense honour to move Bill S-219 at third reading. I want to thank the member for London West from the bottom of my heart for being my seconder and for all her support and encouragement in making today a reality. I want to thank my colleagues on all sides of the House for their participation and collaboration. I cannot say enough good things about the members of the Standing Committee on Indigenous and Northern Affairs, who studied this bill and helped ensure its swift passage through the House at all stages. INAN is a shining example of how committees should work. Each member has made a deep commitment to indigenous peoples across this country, coming from a place of respect and understanding. We were the first committee, I believe, in history to conduct a blanket exercise before our first session to properly set the tone. For those who may not know what a blanket exercise is, it is an experiential learning experience about the story of colonialization. It goes through the true history of Canada, deals with the intergenerational trauma and sets the path toward reconciliation. I would also like to sincerely thank Senator McCallum and her amazing team for their work, guidance and friendship. I will never forget this experience. I had the incredible good fortune to be gifted a ribbon skirt from the senator to mark this special day. Four colours of the medicine wheel don the skirt, a symbol I have drawn strength from since I was a child. Red, yellow, white and black are represented, symbolizing the people of this world, signifying unity and inclusivity. I am a non-indigenous woman and I have been invited to be a part of this movement, which speaks volumes and goes to the heart of the bill. There are also three cornstalks featured on the skirt. To me, this represents motherhood, planting a seed and raising my two sweet Wolastoqey wassisok, my children. I am incredibly grateful, and I will cherish my skirt forever. I also want to note that the main colour is red. The red dress is sacred and represents missing and murdered indigenous women and girls. This week we are in collective mourning for the loss of four more indigenous women in Winnipeg. My heart is with their families. I want to honour them today and add my voice to the call for red dress alerts. No more stolen sisters. I also want to take a moment to acknowledge my colleague from Nunavut for her advocacy for respect and recognition of Inuit women and girls across Canada. Not all indigenous women wear ribbon skirts, and they have their own traditional regalia with significant meaning. This bill is not meant to pan-indigenize, but to speak to anyone who has been made to feel less than or alienated. It is meant to offer strength and positive celebration. To the member from Nunavut, I say qujannamiik. In the words of Senator McCallum, this bill is for Isabella Kulak and her family. I look forward very much to bringing our families together to celebrate this bill, and I am so excited for the prospect of January 4 of 2023 being the first national ribbon skirt day in Canada. At this time, I would like to read some of the testimony we heard at committee to further highlight the importance and significance of this bill. In the words of the senator: This bill will create a forum for dialogue within which we can explore the dark side of Canadian history in ways that do not dishearten or shame, but rather inspire us to enact a process of reconciliation for ourselves, both within our communities and the wider Canadian society. Ribbon skirts themselves are meant to be worn, meant to be danced in, each skirt fashioned with uniqueness, a sign of pride, spirituality, taking back our spirit and making ourselves visible, meant to empower us to be seen. The ribbon skirt will continue our healing and will continue to transmit our history. It is a way to give voice. As we collectively wear our dresses, we gather strength. Marie‑Josée Wapistan said the following: This is not just a national day; it is also a day for us to say that our identity will no longer be disrespected. We, women, want respect for our daughters and sisters, who express their identity by wearing their skirt. When we wear a skirt, we are also carriers of life. We, women, are directly connected to mother earth and to all her strength and splendour. She is our nourishing mother. In the words of Christopher Kulak, Isabella's father, something he and his wife, Lana, often told their children, “You've got to stand up for what's right and what you know to be true in life.” He said: Bella is brave because she's a small little girl who likes to trap rabbits with her dad and wear sweatpants and go into the woods. It was hard for her to put on that skirt. Sometimes she feels like her skin is a little bit pale to be feeling like a native person, but in her heart she's anishinaabekwe. Her culture and her ceremony give her that, and her ancestry. I told her: “You wear that with pride. That's where you come from. Your Auntie Farrah Sanderson made that for you, and it comes from all the hard work from your ancestors who worked so hard to keep those traditions alive.” A poem was read into the record by the senator. It is by Vera Wabegijig and is called jingles speak to the healing. It reads: we carry our stories on our backssometimes stories are heavy,weighing down, curving the spinelike trees bending from the northern windsometimes stories are sharedlike seeds floating on a summer breezetaking root wherever they landbecoming medicine from the earthour stories take rootground us in the earthso we can gather the strengthto stand like the treesand reach for sky This bill is about standing up to ignorance and injustice and turning it into something positive and powerful. I want to acknowledge the 2SLGBTQIA+ people across the land. There is a growing movement of two-spirited powwows and celebrations that ensure safe spaces for all. I give a special shout-out as well to Kieran Davis of Lac Seul First Nation and Treaty 3 territory for wearing a ribbon skirt at this year's Assembly of First Nations Special Chiefs Assembly and for standing up for gender-diverse voices. I see them, I hear them and I hope to amplify them in the House. The ribbon skirt is for everyone, and thanks to Isabella Kulak, we can enshrine this reality into law. To anyone watching at home, keep rocking those skirts and anything else that makes a statement of identity and pride in culture, whether it is moccasin Mondays, traditional Tuesdays, Wolastoq Wednesdays or ribbon skirts every day.

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Mr. Jaime Battiste (Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Crown-Indigenous Relations, Lib.)

Dec/9/22 1:27:51 p.m.
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Re: Bill S-219

Madam Speaker, I would like to thank the member for her advocacy not only today but at the INAN committee. The only thing I am saddened by is that we are not able to see the beautiful ribbon skirt she is wearing. I hope the cameras will pan out as she answers this question so the people at home can see the remarkable skirt she is wearing and the beautiful craftsmanship that indigenous communities continue to promote and recapture after several years of colonization that took away indigenous regalia and indigenous dancing. I have seen and heard of some schools opening up days for children to wear their traditional attire, whether it be ribbon skirts, ribbon shirts or other regalia. I am wondering if the member could comment on the importance of indigenous peoples reclaiming their traditional attire and culture and it being accommodated in schools, government buildings and all across Canada.

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